Weight against muscles

[zeke]

Hello all

My training partners are mostly of the same length as I am (little above 6 ft tall), but they are 180-190 lb instead of my 150. This is a real problem, even tough my muscle mass is Ok (body fat 12%), they simply throw me around. When they kick, the moving mass in their legs makes blocks very difficult. Same thing when they grab me, I can be thrown around like a rag doll.

Currently I'm on P1 level (=yellow belt)

So is really realistic to think that KravMaga works against a substantially heavier/stronger opponent?

/zeke

[Ryan]

Of course. Look, you're judging a relatively static training drill, that relies purely on the physical. There's no psychology, no emotion, no behavioral aspects, etc. Will it be easy? Hell no, it's not a magic pill. Keep in mind the context. Everyone knows what the other is doing, it's being done over and over, and there are no counters (real ones anyway.) Also, there's no consideration for fighting spirit, surprise, etc. You'll get better and more confident with increased training. Odds are you are faster and/or quicker than the bigger guys. You have to use that to your advantage. In my experience, smaller people seem to be more clinical in their approach to training (not all), and therefore are more proficient (not able to rely on strength.)

KM is designed to get you to a level of proficiency quickly, but that's compared to TMAs, and it's all relative. You'll get out of it what you put in it.

[dalamar]

Zeke,

I hear you, man. Most of the guys in my class outweigh my 5'6\" 135lb. frame. In my first two classes I found out immediately that I was going to have to learn how to throw every bit of weight I owned on my skinny frame around.

I'm choosing to work with guys who are taller and outweigh me because in a realistic situation I'm more likely to be defending myself against a meathead than a small Asian martial artist. It's only going to make you tougher. Are you going to be able to take down those larger opponents in your class? More often no than yes, but you're also going against someone who theoretically has the same skills as you. Make it hard in practice that way performance is easy (easier).

Make sure you incorporate your legs and hips into everything you possibly can, especially blocks. It's all about how you use your weight.

[Anonymous]

I'm often one of the smallest people in class and yes that really sucks! But I'm short also and you are pretty tall, so at least you should have about the same reach as those other guys.

Usually lighter people can move faster. So you should try to work on your speed and get angles on your opponents. Watch professional boxers for example. The lighter weight classes move a lot faster than the heavyweights. Or did you see Roy Jones, Jr dancing around John Ruiz for the heavyweight title? He was the smaller man, but he was a lot quicker and able to avoid the clinch (John Ruiz's favorite position!) and was able to score points by hitting him with many quick little punches.

One thing I've noticed personally is that if you are fighting a person up to about 150% of your own body weight technique can compensate well for lack of strength. If your technique is better you can still beat him. If the guy is about 200% of your own bodyweight or even heavier :( it basically turns into a David vs Goliath kind of thing and the surest bet would be to just shoot the SOB or at very least hit him in the head with something. :wink: I mean it's just plain hard, even with technique. But of course in self-defense you will also have the element of surprise, your attacker won't expect you to fight back and in most cases you don't even have to beat him, you just have to hurt him enough to quickly get away to safety. So, yes, I think Krav Maga defenses can still work against a bigger opponent. And from what you've said you are mostly worried about guys about 30-40 pounds heavier and that's not so bad.

If you are new to Krav Maga, you might also find yourself adding on some additional muscle over time, so soon you might be closer in weight to your partners. If you wanted to you could also try some weight lifting.

And if you find yourself holding pads for bigger guys, who make you fly halfway across the room with each kick, don't worry, it'll all just make you stronger! :wink:

[dalamar]

If you are new to Krav Maga, you might also find yourself adding on some additional muscle over time, so soon you might be closer in weight to your partners. If you wanted to you could also try some weight lifting.



I lift some serious weights, four to five days a week, and I'm pretty strong for my size although still smaller.



And if you find yourself holding pads for bigger guys, who make you fly halfway across the room with each kick, don't worry, it'll all just make you stronger!



Same philosophy I have. And if it doesn't make you stronger, it will make you smarter instead. You will learn how \"larger guys\" throw their weight. [/quote]

[jerry68]

Size and weight matter. That is why their are different weight divisions in fighting. The upside is that training with guys bigger than you will help you get stronger than training with guys your own size.

[Ryan]

Jerry, if everything else is equal, then you are right, size matters.

Not to put a sport context to it, but since you mentioned boxing, look at the early UFCs. There were no weight classes, and quite often the smaller guys fared much better. They had technique on their side. However, once people began crosstraining, and the level of competition began to rise, the weight classes were added.

That said, it is still sport--consent, preparation, referee, judges, mats, no fear of death/multiples/weapons, etc. The behavioral and psychological delivery systems are virtually non-existant.

[jerry68]

I always love the \"does size matter\" issue. Having done BJJ for 10 of the last 12 years, I get a lot of \"size doesn't matter\"... Until you see it in reality..

http://12.107.28.178/viewtopic.php?t=263&sid=0f8cc77485f9a7b6d88c097c04d73d67

On every forum board where I have seen this video on, the comments are always about the size of the attacker... In the real world, size always matters, and nothing is ever equal...

[Ryan]

I NEVER said size doesn't matter. In fact, I agreed that it does.

This video shows a big guy with some fighting skills, sucker punching a smaller guy who is passive-aggressive and oblivious. It doesn't prove much. I contend that with training, the smaller guy could have understood the dynamics of what was going on, and de-escalated the situation. If de-escalation was not possible, pre-emption certainly was, and the behavioral delivery system would have been key. He would have still had a fight on his hands, no doubt, but I bet you it wouldn't have gone down like it did (though the guy's size still would have been an issue.)

mass x acceleration=power/force

A fat guy is not going to be to move his mass as fast. Couple that with the ability to know how to involve more of your mass in your strikes, and size becomes less of an issue (not a non-issue, just less of one.)