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Old 02-22-2012, 12:51 AM   #1
Niceguy
 
Default I don't know if KM is for me ?

Hi All

My work often puts me in harms way I deal with drunk people all the time and at time they are violent

I am looking for a way to disable them or get away from them as quickly and harmlessly as possible. There is always the possibility of law suits when they sober up

I need something that I can use quickly and requires a minimum amount of exertion because I have stamina problems I could train an hour a week maybe every other week

I was thinking of Jujitsu but I think the workouts would be too demanding


Thanks
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Old 02-22-2012, 03:22 AM   #2
Joseph Kor
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

This job of yours sound very risky. generally speaking, knowing any kind of Self defense is a positive thing and can be useful. KM, is probably one of the best programs that can offer you what you may require. while therer's a big emphasis on fitness, this doesnt necessraily mean that you need it to pull of some of the techniques. KM SD maneuvers arent about strength or stamina. furthermore, not every school practice alot of groundwork and i've heard some provide very littel, so you might want to look for that school who has more tools on how to fight on the ground if that interest you.




with that said,

if you're not working in the law enforcement or serving in the military, and you find yourself in constant danger during your work. taking SD lessons might not be the first option to consider in solving the problem.

Last edited by Joseph Kor; 02-22-2012 at 03:25 AM.
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Old 02-22-2012, 11:17 AM   #3
Don
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Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niceguy View Post
Hi All

My work often puts me in harms way I deal with drunk people all the time and at time they are violent

I am looking for a way to disable them or get away from them as quickly and harmlessly as possible. There is always the possibility of law suits when they sober up

I need something that I can use quickly and requires a minimum amount of exertion because I have stamina problems I could train an hour a week maybe every other week

I was thinking of Jujitsu but I think the workouts would be too demanding


Thanks
I think you need to make your goals/expectations more realistic. All else being equal, "minimal exertion" usually means not very realistic and/or not preparing you properly...
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Old 02-22-2012, 01:59 PM   #4
Metta World Krav Maga
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Niceguy,

You sound lazy, just like me. Approximately one year ago a nutjob in my old neighborhood (Echo Park, a funky if transitioning neighborhood) was stalking my building, lurking around the front steps, ignoring police orders to stay away, buzzing and threatening tenants, banging on windows, repeatedly trying to sneak in through the laundry room, brandishing a knife on a occasion, etc. After a few days of this, I proceeded to do 3 things. 1) Get a crap ton of pepper spray at a gun store in Burbank (the kind that works on people on meth or PCP) and teach my girlfriend how to use it. 2) Move to another funky if transitioning neighborhood, and a better part of these sorts of neighborhoods. 3) Sign up for Krav Maga, thinking I probably wouldn't last too long but might learn a few useful things. Cut to a year later and I'm hooked, preparing to take my orange belt test (Level 2 to Level 3) next month. It's become a very important part of my life; has helped me personally in ways I never could've imagined, ways completely unrelated to physicality/fitness/self-defense.

That said, take or don't take Krav, but if you regularly find yourself in dangerous situations, you have to do something. At the very least, I'd 1) re-evaluate your work situation. 2) Research pepper spray (the good kind that works on drunk/high people) and the laws pertaining to it as they might relate to you. 3) Take some form of reality based self-defense (RBSD), and soon. A little internet research will lead you in the right direction. Obviously for myself and a lot of other people, Krav Maga is the best. It may or may not be for you (though of all the martial arts -- of which there's some debate about whether Krav Maga is or is not technically a martial art, a topic that's not important at the moment -- Krav Maga is arguably the most useful/comprehensive for self-defense.) Either way, you should probably find out before it's too late, if only for your peace of mind/psychological safety.

Last thing. About the lazy comment. No disrespect intended, especially if you have a real physical limitation (though what you're doing in such a dangerous job if that's the case raises an eyebrow.) Anyway, that wasn't a dig, more an I know where you're coming from show of solidarity. Thing is, there are times in life where the pain of doing nothing (if not being physically attacked) trumps the pain of physical exertion and your own mental limits. This sounds like it could be one of those times for you, as it was for me. However things end up playing out, best of luck, and by all means please stay safe.

Last edited by Metta World Krav Maga; 02-22-2012 at 02:07 PM.
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Old 02-22-2012, 11:15 PM   #5
lions2011
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Hello nice, You mention JJ as training. You must understand that JJ is a very complex system of stand up grappling mostly. JJ consists of many holds and locks that are done mostly standing up and can take years to learn.
Krav Maga system is design to learn in only months. You will need to attend 2 hours a week only to benefit. KM systems will not teach you submissions like JJ or BJJ but will teach you easy to learn defenses and strikes that anybody can grasp as long as they are willing. The most injury I have endured is only cuts and bruises. Nothing serious.
Systems like Muay Thai are far harder on the body. I have been doing MT for several months now and believe me it is harder on the body.
I think if you are serious you should give KM a try. The HQ is in LA area
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Old 02-22-2012, 11:17 PM   #6
lions2011
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Still you can use youtube and find some nice strikes that will greatly enhance your defenses such as throat chops or web of hand strikes.

However, to get the real techniques and mindset you are best to join a school. It will toughen and condition your body and mind.
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Old 02-23-2012, 02:17 AM   #7
Niceguy
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Thanks All

There is a KM school just a short distance from where I live
I can go an watch a class
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Old 02-23-2012, 02:55 AM   #8
KevinMack
 
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Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

I honestly dont think anything of worth in this world can be learned training one hour every two weeks. Martial art or otherwise.
If you consider the way a class is organized you are actually only learning for about a half hr. Even worse.
No offense intended.
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Old 02-23-2012, 02:25 PM   #9
Niceguy
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

No Offense taken
Probably right but I have chronic health problems and over 50 I have to find something I can practice consistently


This is concern
If I am dealing with a drunk male who is confrontational and I strike first I could be sued and it could become my word against his
I would like to learn how to react so I can call it self defense
Or if he breaks an arm or something what do I do ?

I am not a cop so don't have that protection

I just want to subdue him or her then get away and call the cops

Sure appreciate you guys feedback
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Old 02-23-2012, 03:17 PM   #10
Don
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Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

What is your job?
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Old 02-23-2012, 06:05 PM   #11
brewmasher
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

I am over 50, but I do not have any chronic illness that I know of. I just started a KM class, and made it clear that I am going to go at my own speed. The reaction from the staff was overwhelmingly agreed. They do not want you to have a heart attack in class, and want you to come back.

KM is great exercise, and will most likely improve your quality of life. Don't worry about what others are doing, just go at your own pace. Heck, I've seen people in wheelchairs training in KM. You may even like it and start training more!

As far as getting sued, anything is possible in this day and age, but a lot of states are making it tough on frivolous lawsuits. If it is your word against theirs, and they were drunk and you were not, who is a judge or jury to believe? If this is part of your job, take out some liability insurance and let them handle any lawsuits. Your safety should be your first and only concern.
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Old 02-24-2012, 02:34 AM   #12
Niceguy
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

I drive Taxi
I get threatened rarely by other drivers and dirty looks by bouncers but most of all drunk guys and once a drunk woman

I feel like I need to have some effective tactics just in case

Thanks guys appreciate it

My chronic illness is hard to splain
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Old 02-24-2012, 09:37 AM   #13
KMKY
 
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Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Don't let age be the thing that a keeps you from it, I have a 58 year old woman in my class that just reached level 2. She is one of the most determined people in class, she never quits. She worked at her own pace in the beginning and has steadily improved.
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Old 02-24-2012, 09:58 AM   #14
brewmasher
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

KM will defiantly give you more confidence, which will show in your body language. It will also make you more aware of situations so you will avoid most confrontations.

If you work for a taxi company, they will have liability insurance and a bond in case anybody sues, but you will most likely lose your job, which then you can sue them if innocent. A viscous cycle in which lawyers are the only winners. If you are a private owner, check with your insurance company on your coverage for such situations.

Might want to check on additional personal insurance in case they try to sue you personally. It's not that much, and the peace of mind is worth it.
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Old 02-24-2012, 11:16 AM   #15
Niceguy
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

My biggest hazard is the people sitting behind me


I also had a drunk/high guy attack me from the passenger seat while I was driving fortunately I was going slow on a city street so I could stop

Then you sometimes get people that are angry with you because you won't permit them to eat or drink in the car
They get out with a huff and slam your door hard

I once had a highway patrol man who's wife was drunk and throwing up on herself tell me to break all kinds of laws because they were in a hurry I would have liked to have kicked him out of my cab... but not sure what those guys will do

If KM can help me with those types of situations it would be useful can it?

Last edited by Niceguy; 02-24-2012 at 11:25 AM.
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Old 02-24-2012, 11:19 AM   #16
Niceguy
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

it's not age so much because I work at staying fit but it is a factor
but more it's the illness
Should I tell the instructor I have an illness and have to pace?
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Old 02-24-2012, 01:16 PM   #17
PinkGloves
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KMKY View Post
Don't let age be the thing that a keeps you from it, I have a 58 year old woman in my class that just reached level 2. She is one of the most determined people in class, she never quits. She worked at her own pace in the beginning and has steadily improved.

I couldn't agree more with this. My mother also does Krav Maga. She turned 60 last month and plans on testing for level 5 within the year.

To Niceguy: You should absolutely be upfront with your instructor about any illness or injury. As was previously stated, instructors do not want you injuring or stressing yourself in class to the point you are unable to defend yourself on the street.
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Old 02-24-2012, 01:16 PM   #18
stuartf
 
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Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niceguy View Post
it's not age so much because I work at staying fit but it is a factor
but more it's the illness
Should I tell the instructor I have an illness and have to pace?
I'd tell the instructor, but I'd also consult with a doctor. Obviously the only way to improve will be to push yourself, so know what the limits/symptoms are before you start. For example it'd be OK for a healthy person to continue when they're out of breath, but an asthmatic person might need to take that as sign to stop before they trigger an attack.
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Old 02-25-2012, 11:13 AM   #19
WayneTheGuru
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Kor View Post
This job of yours sound very risky. generally speaking, knowing any kind of Self defense is a positive thing and can be useful. KM, is probably one of the best programs that can offer you what you may require. while therer's a big emphasis on fitness, this doesnt necessraily mean that you need it to pull of some of the techniques. KM SD maneuvers arent about strength or stamina. furthermore, not every school practice alot of groundwork and i've heard some provide very littel, so you might want to look for that school who has more tools on how to fight on the ground if that interest you.




with that said,

if you're not working in the law enforcement or serving in the military, and you find yourself in constant danger during your work. taking SD lessons might not be the first option to consider in solving the problem.
I'd have to disagree. Self defense (in any study or form) is an excellent way to mitigate this gentleman's dangerous situations from escalating too much so as to cause harm.

Niceguy, I would look into more diciplined studies like Kung Fu, Tase Kwon Do, or even Karate. although they may seem to be the more "mainstream" studies, they are still veyr effective. What sets them apart from others I have studied is the martial art focuses in more on discipline and being humble, rather than aggressive defensie mechanics. I was in Tae Kwon Do for years, and it taught me to be humble but firm in my defense methods.

Also, ain regards to the legal aspect of your concern, if you are using the proper amount of force so as to justifiably and properly disarm, disable (not handicap), or subdue someone in your place of business because it is your employment responsibility, you are allowed to do so. Key word in that sentence is "justifiably"!
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Old 02-25-2012, 03:04 PM   #20
Don
Force
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Force Training Division
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Driving a taxi can be an unpredictable and dangerous job. As someone else asked, are you your own boss or do you work for a company? If you work for a company, what is your policy(ies) on accepting fares/denying service? What is your policy(ies) on physically resisting assault and/or carrying self-defense tools? What features does your cab have - e.g. do you have any hard separation between the front and rear compartments?

No self-defense training may be enough to help you overcome or nullify the dangers resulting from the combination of physical impairment and a risky job. You may have to realize that driving a cab may not be the best choice for you and that another line of work may be better for your general well-being and safety.


Btw, "humble" and "firm" does not mean much when you're being assaulted by some drunk idiot who doesn't care what kind of demeanor you have.
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Old 02-26-2012, 03:12 AM   #21
Niceguy
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

[quote=Don;55164]Driving a taxi can be an unpredictable and dangerous job. As someone else asked, are you your own boss or do you work for a company? If you work for a company, what is your policy(ies) on accepting fares/denying service? What is your policy(ies) on physically resisting assault and/or carrying self-defense tools? What features does your cab have - e.g. do you have any hard separation between the front and rear compartments?

My response
I work for myself
I can deny service to anyone I want
No policy on resisting Assault
I carry self defense tools
No hard seperation I work in a fairly upscale area but still an occasional problem
No one said anything about physical impairment
Believe it or not other drivers can be a problem too
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:22 PM   #22
MDeaneUSCG
Force Training Division
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

[quote=Niceguy;55168]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don View Post
Driving a taxi can be an unpredictable and dangerous job. As someone else asked, are you your own boss or do you work for a company? If you work for a company, what is your policy(ies) on accepting fares/denying service? What is your policy(ies) on physically resisting assault and/or carrying self-defense tools? What features does your cab have - e.g. do you have any hard separation between the front and rear compartments?

My response
I work for myself
I can deny service to anyone I want
No policy on resisting Assault
I carry self defense tools
No hard seperation I work in a fairly upscale area but still an occasional problem
No one said anything about physical impairment
Believe it or not other drivers can be a problem too
Niceguy,

The first thing I would suggest, since you work for yourself, is that if you feel this is enough of a problem to warrant self defense tools and the possibility of taking krav, that you get a hard separator for your car. Whether you are in an 'up-scale' area or not, if you feel your physical well being is threatened, why not do something about it?

It would be nice to know what sort of limitations your illness DOES place on you. I know you said it is difficult to explain, but understanding what it keeps you from doing would be helpful. Can you not heavily exert yourself for any length of time? Does it limit your ability to move in any way? etc.

Krav Maga is a system designed to be learned by anyone, and can be scaled to your capabilities. The primary requirement for someone walking in the door is determination, and a willingness to learn. A lot of our techniques do focus on the aggressive response to a violent encounter, because that is reality. If you have to defend your life, you have to be willing to pull out all the stops. If you are in fear of bodily harm, you have to be willing to cause bodily harm to the attacker, because they have no issues doing it to you. Not only that, but your willingness (not eagerness) to do so will be evident in your body language, and may de-escalate the situation without violence. Your positioning in relation to a potential threat increases your disadvantage, and your ability and willingness to respond violently to an attack is a necessity if you feel you are in regular danger.

You have to remember, anyone can sue for anything in this country. I just heard of a case where a robber entered a victim's house, shot him, and the victim shot the robber three times. Guess what, the robber sued the victim. That doesn't mean he won though. Fear of a lawsuit needs to be the last thing on your mind, until you feel you are safe enough to let it in again. In krav maga, one of the principles is to identify the primary and secondary threats, and deal with them by priority when possible. In your case, the threat of a lawsuit is at the very end of that priority list.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:33 PM   #23
Don
Force
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Force Training Division
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

[quote=Niceguy;55168]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don View Post
Driving a taxi can be an unpredictable and dangerous job. As someone else asked, are you your own boss or do you work for a company? If you work for a company, what is your policy(ies) on accepting fares/denying service? What is your policy(ies) on physically resisting assault and/or carrying self-defense tools? What features does your cab have - e.g. do you have any hard separation between the front and rear compartments?

My response
I work for myself
I can deny service to anyone I want
Then you can also refuse service to potentially problematic or dangerous customers too.

No policy on resisting Assault
I carry self defense tools
Make sure you know when/how you can use them or otherwise protect yourself.

No hard seperation I work in a fairly upscale area but still an occasional problem
Why not look into adding some sort of similar protection into your vehicle?

No one said anything about physical impairment
Ok, no "physical impairment" per se, but if you have a medical condition or chronic illness that prohibits or inhibits your ability to work out strenuously, then you're not going to gain the full benefit of whatever it is you're training in.

Believe it or not other drivers can be a problem too
Believe it or not? You see where I live, don't you?
The difference is that other drivers are not inside your cab with you. If you're Consistently experiencing problems with other drivers, then perhaps there is a chance that something about your driving is contributing to that problem.
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:07 PM   #24
Niceguy
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Thanks

Appreciate the feedback guys

It gives me some things to think about

There are three martial arts schools near by
I will look in to them

KM seems like the best choice so far but I will need to watch a practice
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:35 PM   #25
Ingus
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

I have another reason I don't know if his is for me.
Two actually, but one is physical and I'll work that out, the other is cost.
Lay it on me.
Because while some of yous might be rolling in it, Im not sure I can swing it, no matter how driven I am.

So east coast dollars, what does it cost monthly.

Thanks
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:05 PM   #26
Don
Force
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Force Training Division
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niceguy View Post
Thanks

Appreciate the feedback guys

It gives me some things to think about

There are three martial arts schools near by
I will look in to them

KM seems like the best choice so far but I will need to watch a practice
Whichever school you are checking out, ask if they offer a free trial class or two where you can actually participate too...
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Old 02-27-2012, 03:52 PM   #27
mara_jade
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Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingus View Post
I have another reason I don't know if his is for me.
Two actually, but one is physical and I'll work that out, the other is cost.
Lay it on me.
Because while some of yous might be rolling in it, Im not sure I can swing it, no matter how driven I am.

So east coast dollars, what does it cost monthly.

Thanks
Sorry but there's one size fits all in terms of cost. Even in the same region it depends on what classes are offered, membership types. You can look at this thread for ideas

http://www.kravmaga.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4547
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:33 PM   #28
MDeaneUSCG
Force Training Division
 
Default Re: I don't know if KM is for me ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingus View Post
I have another reason I don't know if his is for me.
Two actually, but one is physical and I'll work that out, the other is cost.
Lay it on me.
Because while some of yous might be rolling in it, Im not sure I can swing it, no matter how driven I am.

So east coast dollars, what does it cost monthly.

Thanks
Also, from my experience, many instructors are more interested in getting the knowledge out to those that need it, than getting a signed contract for a membership. You could likely work out a special arrangement for your situation, whether it is class by class, or something else. Especially in our current economy, I think tight budgets something many of us deal with.
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