\"Operational\" KM?

[MaskedKat]

Anyone familiar with this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-m5YEacEsM

[determined]

i've never heard of this before but i'd love to participate. i'm not law enforcement but i do love guns and anytime i can go out and shoot i do.

one thing i would love to go through are car-jacking situations. but i guess it'd be a pain to get a bunch of students outside running these drills in a car. (hey psyops, if you're reading this have you ever thought of doing that in one of your classes?)

by the way, that handgun defense shown in the video i've never seen before. anyone out there practice that in class?

[Anonymous]

Some of the stuff looked weird, such as the neck-twisting takedowns. Don't know about the handcuff gun defense. For the rifle in the plane or classroom (not sure which it was supposed to be), why doesn't he do a more regular rifle defense? Would those neck twists really work in an actual situation?

As for carjacking, yeah let's do it again. :D We used to do it once in a while, but haven't in some time.

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Giantkiller

[chopper]

the neck twisting he uses in the video is not for a take down its a finishing move, if you did it on someone you would seriously injure them

[kravjeff]

Looks awesome ...

Not sure if I buy into the Jean-Claude neck break, but ... Where the head goes, the body will follow - Certainly would be effective takedowns, and I'm sure woud inflict pain. :twisted:

[MaskedKat]

That looked like it could be lethal to me.

[Rick Prado]

The neck twists shown are definitely finishing moves and must be practiced very carefully, you can easily sprain your partners neck or worse and should only be done with supervsion.

I like and use it a lot because the head is easy access and it's very hard to resist.

I bought some \"israeli connection\" vidoes last year in which the instructor emphasizes the head/neck control techniques and have been incorporating them into my training ever since.

Where the head goes, the body will follow.

Not all of the techniques are \"finishing\" moves, there are different levels of intensity, depending on the situation, but you can certainly control someone by the necl/head without snapping it.

[Emil]

I am a little bit confused by the neck \"twisting\". While it would cause a sprain, it would seem that it would be faster and more damaging to crank the neck, especially in the direction it doesn't usually go.

[kravjeff]

Originally Posted by \"MaskedKat\"

That looked like it could be lethal to me.

Too many movies ... :wink:

I'm sure they can be lethal / cause devstating injuries ... Just don't think it's like we see on tv. And while I've never been trained to do it, I assume there's a lot of training involved (like everything else we do). I doubt it's as simple as it looks.

[Rick Prado]

I've never had to snap someones neck, thankfully, but I am told that snapping it is not that much harder, than controlling some by their neck, if done at the proper angles.

Like anything else, the opponent has to be \"lossened\" up first, it would be infinitely harder to do on someone who hasn't been bent over by a knee, groin kick, etc.....

.02

[MaskedKat]

Originally Posted by \"kravjeff\"

Too many movies ... :wink:

I'm sure they can be lethal / cause devstating injuries ... Just don't think it's like we see on tv. And while I've never been trained to do it, I assume there's a lot of training involved (like everything else we do). I doubt it's as simple as it looks.

Yeah, nothing is ever like we see on TV. I've never been trained to do it either and doubt it'd be \"simple.\" Besides, I have this thing about neck breaks.... gimme the willies. I can handle the thought of jabbing someone's eye socket but hearing a neck snap? Ugh.... I had a hard time guillotining my partner in class because it really just creeps me out. Guess I better learn to get over it, hmm?

[Anonymous]

How do you train to do those neck twists? Obviously, you couldn't go full force on your partner. I wonder if you would be able to do them correctly in a real situation, if you have never been able to do them at full force in class.

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Giantkiller

[Rick Prado]

Originally Posted by \"Giantkiller\"

How do you train to do those neck twists? Obviously, you couldn't go full force on your partner. I wonder if you would be able to do them correctly in a real situation, if you have never been able to do them at full force in class.

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Giantkiller

Good question. I won't know if I will be able to perform them in a real life scenario unless faced with that reality.

I'm pretty sure I can inflict some pain, not sure about the neck break though.

I do know that I have been able to manipulate someone by their head/neck fairly easy and have had the same done to me, at full speed.

[Anonymous]

It would be cool, if there was a training tool, such as an artificial head and neck, that one could twist at full force, to see how much damage would have been caused. Don't know if there is anything like that, though.

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Giantkiller

[Rick Prado]

Originally Posted by \"Giantkiller\"

It would be cool, if there was a training tool, such as an artificial head and neck, that one could twist at full force, to see how much damage would have been caused. Don't know if there is anything like that, though.

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Giantkiller

Great idea...patent pending.... :)

[greenbeanie]

Originally Posted by \"kravjeff\"

Not sure if I buy into the Jean-Claude neck break

Some RBSD systems teach this technique as one of three objectives for handling an assailant: (1) takedown and control, (2) incapacitation, and (3) termination. For example, for a termination objective, you twist the head east to west and when you get to about southwestÖabruptly and violentlyÖpull the head in a northeast direction. If the assailant fights your east to west move by turning his head west to east, accommodate him and when he gets to about southeastÖabruptly and violentlyÖpull the head in a northwest direction.

[Psyops]

Originally Posted by \"determined\"

i've never heard of this before but i'd love to participate. i'm not law enforcement but i do love guns and anytime i can go out and shoot i do.

one thing i would love to go through are car-jacking situations. but i guess it'd be a pain to get a bunch of students outside running these drills in a car. (hey psyops, if you're reading this have you ever thought of doing that in one of your classes?)

by the way, that handgun defense shown in the video i've never seen before. anyone out there practice that in class?

Determined,

We have done car jacking scenarios in class on a number of occasions. Usually we do this at the weapons class. Check the schedule and the next time you come in let us know and we will review these again. The weapons class is one of my favorite classes to teach. So please let me know and we can review it!