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I don’t know if I accept the idea of treating it as an assault at the workplace. Consider hockey: If I go to a hockey game and don’t see a fight, I’m a little dissapointed. Granted, this is a little different, especially once fans are involved (but there’s probably some sort of disclaimer that says that once you buy a ticket, players are allowed to beat you with socks full of pennies)
Hi GK! \”Guerriere\” is French for female warrior. I would have been back sooner but I agonized over a new name!
>>Artest had just been shoved, but chose not to fight<<
…yup, and when a fan gave him a direction for his frustration he took it. Maybe he needs krav! One of the cool things about krav (and one of the reasons I signed up) is that it teaches restraint. If your life isn’t in danger, don’t fight as if it is, or don’t fight at all! Charles Barclay was on TV saying something to the effect if someone disrespects him he has the right to beat him up (verrrry liberal paraphrase here). These are the type of idiots we’re training to defend against — people whose egos are so big that they are more important to them than their lives, and more important than other people’s lives.
CLFMark, hockey players beat each other up, but they don’t beat up the fans. At least I don’t think they do. IMHO it still should be considered an assault because it’s not part of the way the game is supposed to be played. Giving someone a 2-minute time out for something that the fans would get a few weeks’ time out and a hefty fine for doesn’t seem right to me.
Bonjour Guerriere!
Tu parles francais? Tres bien! 😉
I agree with CLKMak, I think people actually like to watch players fight, it’s kind of entertaining. A lot of people might not like to admit it, but they still like to watch it. I think that’s why they let players get away with it, as long as no-one is seriously injured (like this one time when that hockey player hit the other hockey player from behind and knocked him unconscious). Also, if they arrested every player, who ever threw a punch, soon there’s be no players left!’:lol:’
I don’t know if Artest’s reaction was really an ‘ego’ thing. I think he just got mad and snapped. He was already angry and tried to calm down and then that cup went flying… I mean, everyone is mad at him, but what about the fan? No-one had provoked him, so why did he have to throw that cup, which, thrown from that distance, probably hurt just like a strong punch.
If I went up to you and suddenly threw a cup in your face, hurting you, wouldn’t you get mad at me and want to hurt me back? Of course you shouldn’t, you should restrain yourself, but if you were angry already about something else, maybe you would just snap and jump at me. Okay, maybe you wouldn’t, but Artest did. He shouldn’t have, but I can see how it might happen.
I was cleaning up some old newspapers and I found a September 15 story:
\”Pitcher charged with battery\”
Major League Baseball yesterday launched an investigation into a brawl between Texas Rangers players and Oakland Athletics fans…which left a female fan with a bloodied and broken nose and resulted in the arrest early yesterday of Rangers relief pitcher Frank Francisco.
Francisco, a 25-year-old rookie, was charged with aggravated battery, a felony, for throwing a plastic chair into the stands near the Rangers’ bullpen and striking two fans, including the unidentified woman. He was released two hours later on $15,000 bail.\”
I’m not into sports but if I had to spend 3 hours on my butt watching a sport, it would be baseball! I’m more of an opera fan — someone always dies onstage, but then they get up and take bows. I don’t mind seeing violence as long as it’s fake and well sung! 😛
Like I said, fans really change the dynamics of it. I’m sure that fan will be a rich man soon enough, but I doubt any players will get any jail time. In modern America, sports stars and celebrities are raised to a mythic quality- it can be kind of disturbing.
That screw up threw a chair into a crowd because of verbal assults, pretty weak. he deserves assult charges.
As to Aston going into the crowd, he get’s a little more leway assuming he was after the cup thrower. To bad he grabbed the wrong guy!
I watched it real close and the guy that gets in his face on the court actually didn’t cross the line onto the playing area. He stopped right at the edge. He still should have stayed in his seat.
It was neat that that edge line made an unconcious stopping point for the guy. Reminded me of UFC 1 where the sumo guy got knocked over and just sat there, and got kick in the face and his tooth flew out!! It seemed like he was conditioned to relax after he got pushed out of the sumo ring, and the line on the floor of the octogon tricked him. Ha! Sorry alittle of topic.
Charges have been filed!
http://www.mlive.com/news/fljournal/index.ssf?/base/news-25/1102612824181960.xml
2 area men charged with tossing chair, cup in Pistons brawl
PONTIAC
THE FLINT JOURNAL FIRST EDITION
Thursday, December 09, 2004
By Bob Wheaton
[email protected] • 810.766.6375
PONTIAC – Two Genesee County men were among seven fans charged Wednesday in their roles in the Nov. 19 brawl at The Palace between spectators and Indiana Pacers players.Five Pacers also were charged.
While Bryant D. Jackson, 35, of Mundy Township was expected to be charged with throwing a chair during the melee, it was somewhat of a surprise that William Paulson, 26, of Burton was charged with throwing a beverage at Pacer Ron Artest. ..
Jackson faces up to 8 years in prison if he is convicted of felonious assault for throwing the chair, which struck several people. Jackson also is charged with misdemeanor assault for hurling beer at Artest.
Felonious assault usually is punishable by up to 4 years in prison, but Jackson faces a longer sentence because he has previous convictions and will be tried as an habitual offender, Gorcyca said.
Gorcyca said more charges also could be filed.
Now that arrest warrants have been issued, the players and fans charged are required to turn themselves in, Gorcyca said. Jackson appeared briefly before a judge at 52nd District Court in Rochester Hills on Wednesday afternoon.
Jackson told the judge that he has a prior conviction for carrying a concealed weapon nine years ago and a misdemeanor domestic violence conviction three or four years ago.
Approached by reporters for comment after his appearance, Jackson raised his fist and said only, \”Pistons!\”
********************
There’s more at the site but…. YIPPEE for the prosecutors!Imagine how many would be doing time for their behavior on daytime TV and fake wrestling… um… I wonder where he got the idea of throwing a chair?
Well the idiot just threw the chair over everyones heads deep into the melee. Thats not self defense in any sense, thats assult and very stupid! I am glad he got charged and I hope he get’s 8 years.
On a side note, a soccer game in italy this week banned ALL the fans from attending the match due to bad behaviour in the past. The two teams played to an empty stadium. If the NBA did this a few times, the fans would start controling eachother, not accelerating the melee into a riot.
I think compared to European sports fans, our fans are relatively well-behaved. Here they might throw a cup or a chair on occasion. In Europe, after a big soccer game, they usually pour out of the stadium and proceed to trash the entire city and battle police!
Interesting idea to ban all the fans. What two clubs were playing? I don’t know if that was the right strategy, though. Only gave them two more hours to trash the city! 😆
I’m not sure they would want to try that here. No fans, no revenue, no million-dollar salaries. Besides, I could just bet some of the well-behaved fans would file a lawsuit claiming it’s collective punishment and since the joy of attending a basketball game was taken away from them they deserve compensation of, oh well, a few million dollars? 😆Not sure about that chair thrower. Yeah, it was stupid and not self-defense, but eight years for some dumb thing the guy did in the heat of the moment? I don’t know. How about probation? Or maybe a few months.
RE: European soccer match without any fans.
It was Real Madrid, arguably the most popular team in organized sports in the world, and AS Roma. The game was during the second round of the UEFA Champions League and played in Roma’s 80,000 plus capacity olympic stadium. Romans were being penalized for injuring a referee a few matches back by throwing a coin at his face.
Speaking about european hooliganism and Real Madrid; a bomb scare, allegedly from a Basque separatist movement, caused Real’s game to be cancelled yesterday during the waning minutes. The Bernebau stadium in Madrid (that holds in the upwards of 90,000) was evacauated. When was the last time anything like this happened in the NBA?
Wow, so it was actually an important game where this happened? What a weird kind of fan punishment. I wonder if it did any good and the fans are better behaved now.:lol:
I guess a bomb scare could happen at the NBA, imagine al Qaeda were to phone in and say that they are planning on blowing up the finals or something! 🙁
Oh, yeah and…. Was denn nun bloss fuer ein Feuer??!! 🙄
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