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Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
Krav Maga can’t “be” without being open to other systems.
I too have had training in FMA! I still use some of the techniques as they are very useful. For instance in Krav Maga we often encourage students to “pick up” items and use them as weapons. Yet very rarely do you see a Krav Maga instructor actually teach a student how to properly or most effectively hold a knife, stick, etc…. at least from an offensive standpoint.
I do show students how to do swing a stick most effectively. Knives too. This is essential. Sometimes students and instructors are closed to training in other systems because they are “being loyal” to KM. This is foolish. Especially when you consider that there are so many “ground and pounders” studying Krav and teaching in Krav Maga schools things that clearly violate the principles of Krav Maga yet it is embraced.
Your cup should never be full. It should always be empty. JKD, Kajukenbo, and some FMA are equally effective in certain situations. Take a look at them before judging.
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
Correct me if I am wrong, but it was my understanding that there is no central governing body for JKD certification. Basically, anyone could hang a sign outside his school advertising JKD, because it is a concept/philosophy. Krav Maga, on the otherhand, has organizations that hold schools and instructors responsible for obtaining certifications.
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
quote phlegmon27:Correct me if I am wrong, but it was my understanding that there is no central governing body for JKD certification. Basically, anyone could hang a sign outside his school advertising JKD, because it is a concept/philosophy. Krav Maga, on the otherhand, has organizations that hold schools and instructors responsible for obtaining certifications.Your point being?
Are you suggesting that because KM has “organizations that hold schools and instructors responsible for obtaining certifications” that KM is somehow more “legit” than JKD or JFJKD? Are you suggesting that just because KM has a central governing body (is there one that covers ALL the branches of KM?) that EVERY school out there that claims to teach KM or EVERY instructor who claims to have KM certification IS actually legitimate?
Fakes and frauds come in all shapes and sizes and forms. From what little I’ve read here on the board and seen on the internet, and contrary to what you seem to be suggesting, KM is NOT immune from some of the same problems that plague/have plagued the JKD community (and any “flavor of the month” martial art over the years) – i.e. people claiming to be certified instructors or schools claiming to teach KM (and I’m not just talking about CKM/Moni).
Just because someone/someplace claims to teach KM or JKD/FMA or [insert your choice of MA here] doesn’t mean you should automatically assume it’s legit just because of the name. If someone claims to be certified to teach JKD, all I would do is ask them who certified them to instruct and follow the lineage – maybe it’s easier for me because I have some idea of who most of the players are in JKD.
I don’t want to get into a whole discussion on choosing a MA, school, instructor, etc. It wouldn’t surprise me if there was some yahoo out there falsely claiming to be certified to teach both JKD and KM (and BJJ and muay thai and whathaveyou).
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
My point being…nothing.
It was an observation/question.
One should always research the credentials of someone claiming to be an “expert”, and having a central governing body just makes that easier.
That’s all, no disrespect intended.
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
I started training with Guros Richard and Dan in 88 when they were still teaching under the same roof (more “off” than “on” from then to today). Prior to that, there was a couple of years of TSD and a bunch of miscellaneous classes here and there in various styles with different instructors at a wide variety of locations – nothing to write home about. Along the way, I’ve had the privilege of receiving instruction from some awesome people in the JKD and FMA communities. I still have a great deal of loyalty to my instructors and consider JKD/FMA to be my “roots”.
I apologize for being overly sensitive!
IMO, the larger an organization grows and the farther it spreads, the tougher it can be to maintain good quality control. From what I’ve seen so far, KMWW does an excellent job of maintaining quality. In JKD/FMA, we really didn’t have any belts but you knew where you stood just by training with your classmates and instructors. OTOH, I do like the fact that, similar to “authentic” BJJ schools, if you earn a certain rank through KMWW, you deserve it and it shows – no strip mall mcdojo here’s a belt keep paying and coming to class phony baloney…
IMO, JKD has had more problems because Sigung Bruce was a movie star and everybody and their pet monkey seems to have wanted to jump on that bandwagon – look how many articles in various MA magazines are Still dedicated to Bruce Lee/JKD over 35 years AFTER his death!
I believe that KMWW is better set up to deal with a “commercial explosion” but it will still be interesting to see how things go when KM becomes even more well-known mainstream… Sometimes you don’t hear about all the phonies who are cashing in…
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
in jkd the only true way to tell a shyster from the real thing is lineage. i trace my lineage right back to sifu paul vunak. there are many so called jkd instructors with no lineage but those of that can be traced back to vunak/ inosanto are certainly legit. i still train the way i was taught by my sifu and the way he was taught by his. techniques may have changed, but the intensity of training has not. i have added what i have learned in KM and have embraced it for being a reality based seld defense system that has the same prinicples
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
Jun Fan Jeet Kune Do has techniques, but Jeet Kune Do in itself is just a concept. Saying that Jeet Kune Do is like Krav Maga can be a stretch depending on how Krav is being taught.
As stated earlier, Jeet Kune Do is a concept that is rooted in personal expression through whatever training an individual has studied. Style centric, one size fits all approach to self defense is not what Jeet Kune Do represents. It’s about an individuals personal voyage in pursuit of learning how to defend themselves using anything they may have been exposed to. Also, Jeet Kune Do teaches that preset defenses can prevent an individual from being able to adapt on the fly to a real attack.
Krav uses a small set of techniques to address a variety of attacks which is a bit different.
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
quote Psyops:Krav Maga can’t “be” without being open to other systems.I too have had training in FMA! I still use some of the techniques as they are very useful. For instance in Krav Maga we often encourage students to “pick up” items and use them as weapons. Yet very rarely do you see a Krav Maga instructor actually teach a student how to properly or most effectively hold a knife, stick, etc…. at least from an offensive standpoint.
I do show students how to do swing a stick most effectively. Knives too. This is essential. Sometimes students and instructors are closed to training in other systems because they are “being loyal” to KM. This is foolish. Especially when you consider that there are so many “ground and pounders” studying Krav and teaching in Krav Maga schools things that clearly violate the principles of Krav Maga yet it is embraced.
Your cup should never be full. It should always be empty. JKD, Kajukenbo, and some FMA are equally effective in certain situations. Take a look at them before judging.
true. i was taught some offensive techniques with a knife that arent km at a knife defenses seminar.
however the instructor had a military background and taught Army combatives and is for lack of a better word, a certified badass. he brought that to the training and we got tons out of it.so while i didn’t mean to take shots at jkd, my point was being that it’d be difficult for me to find a good jkd school in my area without knowing how to trace their lineage. a governing body makes that somewhat easier. before km i did boxing and a form of Aikido taught by a Former member of the Fruit of Islam (the nation of islams security force. their claim to fame was cleaning up Paradise and Mayfair in Northeast DC during the height of the drug trade) basically he mixed aikido with kickboxing. in class sometimes i have to get that boxing “instinct” out of me and do it the krav maga way.
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
while having no formal training in JKD
i’ve always been a fan of Bruce Lee and his principles ( take what is useful )
and one of my favorite martial arts books is Tao of JKD
and so this has lead me to KMi’ve always been a big fan of realistic traning ( street clothes/sneakers/anywhere/anytime/unexpected )
the only problem i’ve had is finding someone to train with
( that’s not how they do it at the dojo )trying to get a friend to practice/train with me, we’ll see how that goes
right now, KM has rekindled my interest in training again
EDIT: have to get used to these threads/posts going backwards
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
quote S31:while having no formal training in JKD
i’ve always been a fan of Bruce Lee and his principles ( take what is useful )
and one of my favorite martial arts books is Tao of JKD
and so this has lead me to KMi’ve always been a big fan of realistic traning ( street clothes/sneakers/anywhere/anytime/unexpected )
the only problem i’ve had is finding someone to train with
( that’s not how they do it at the dojo )trying to get a friend to practice/train with me, we’ll see how that goes
right now, KM has rekindled my interest in training again
EDIT: have to get used to these threads/posts going backwards
you can change the way the posts show up on your specific settings
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
Has anyone seen the ad in the Black Belt Magazine about an annual retreat?
Paul Vunak is having an annual retreat held on Friday, August 12th through Monday, August 15th, 2011.
This seminar extravaganza has been in the making for 3 years. In August of 2009 we reserved the most beautiful beach front paradise in California. Finally this year we got it. We have gathered our resources together and pulled out all of the plugs! Our agenda is so packed we needed to add a 3rd day, for a total of 24 hours of total Jeet Kune Do submersion. We call this seminar the “Metamorphosis of Jeet Kune Do.”
This retreat will be held at Doheny Beach in Dana Point, CA. For more information, go to http://www.fighting.net/seminars. We are looking forward to seeing some Krav Maga forum members at the retreat. Please spread the word to other passionate fans of Bruce Lee, Krav Maga and Paul Vunak.
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
I guess someone decided to post an ad on this old thread of mine. It was a pretty good thread there for a while.
Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
JKD has some good things like it stresses eye jabs, knee kicks and groin kicks.
Much similarity among KM and JKD. Krav techniques I think are more powerful through while JKD is more based on speed and quickness.
I think in JKD they dont chamber much on there kicks as Bruce Lee really stressed speed and quickness.
Plus Krav deals with weapons, choke defenses and multiple opponents while JKD does not I think.
Still Krav is more western type of system while JKD is more Asian as it stresses striking and blocking at the same time as does much of Kung fu.
I find that very hard to do.Krav seems to have more powerful type of blows I think.
I could be wrong but this is what I read. Please dont yell at me if I am wrong.Re: Jeet Kune Do and Krav Maga
quote lions2011:JKD has some good things like it stresses eye jabs, knee kicks and groin kicks.Much similarity among KM and JKD. Krav techniques I think are more powerful through while JKD is more based on speed and quickness.
I think in JKD they dont chamber much on there kicks as Bruce Lee really stressed speed and quickness.
Plus Krav deals with weapons, choke defenses and multiple opponents while JKD does not I think.
Still Krav is more western type of system while JKD is more Asian as it stresses striking and blocking at the same time as does much of Kung fu.
I find that very hard to do.Krav seems to have more powerful type of blows I think.
I could be wrong but this is what I read. Please dont yell at me if I am wrong.???????
One of the primary focal points of krav maga is simultaneous defense and attack. If you wait until after you are attacked to strike, you will be in trouble, think knife defenses or better yet, knife survival.
In fact, pre-emptive strikes are even more important. Top Krav Maga practitioners will tell you that it’s impossible to block everything and that the best defense is a good offense.
As far as the differences, Krav Maga was initially a military system, borne out of the desperation of the Jewish people to survive anti-semitism. I don’t think that Bruce Lee had quite the same motivation, although I am a big fan and hope to get involved in it one day.
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