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Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote MagaMike:Some people taking KM may think “anything goes” will hold up in court if they were attacked….ìThe legal essence of self-defense is that you are required to use ëthe minimum level of forceí which you ëreasonably believeí is necessary to safely resolve the situation.î
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
Hey, it’s it’s some guy trying to do me harm (rape, etc), the last thing my brain’s gonna worry about is whether messing up his face is a problem. The guy wants to mess up my life.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
nice topic, you got my attention. I guess we’ll discuss kravmasutra later.
I think training in different levels of force is vital.
If all you know is to destroy your opponent your training will not help you in a lot of conflicts where you know you will simply not use it.
If someone grabs your shirt and tells you you are a ^&^%$$%^ the situation is threatning enough to make sure you create distance very fast.
However if you have to explain in court about how you really need to use his head as a soccerball 10 times because he grabbed your shirt, it will cost you a bit more than a new shirt. When I started security work I was mostly experienced as a boxer. In most cases punching people was really not going to help my career.
I’m really glad to have more options that are suitable for more daily situations.
I’m also glad I’m not doing that work fulltime anymore 🙂On the other hand you should not think twice about destroying the attacker if that’s what you need to do.
Any type of doubt that causes you to freeze when you need to react is dangerous. Decision making under stress is one of the most important things you will learn.I really like the quote about the “go list”
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote mara_jade:Hey, it’s it’s some guy trying to do me harm (rape, etc), the last thing my brain’s gonna worry about is whether messing up his face is a problem. The guy wants to mess up my life.I think the crucial difference is (and I work with a lot of law enforcement personnel) escalation (did you use a knife to defend yourself on the street when s/he attacked with their person) and once subdued/escaped situation did you continue with the beating? The only time when I know escalation can be used legally is protection of home under “Castle Law” where one can use deadly force in response to a break-in. Most district attorneys do not look favorably upon someone who successfully subdues their attacker but then goes onto inflict severe/lethal damage. The general rule is if you can escape-do so and call the authorities. If you can’t, subdue and call the cops. If they escalate the force, then you can escalate to same level (don’t bring a gun to a knife fight).
It is really going to boil down to how aggressive the district attorney’s office can be.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
The best thing you can do, short of getting the hell out of there, is to bring a gun to a knife fight.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
Yea, as someone who frequents bars I often wonder how Krav training would apply to a common scenario like a bar fight. Some drunk idiot gives you a good shove because he doesn’t like the way you glanced at his beer glass, do you go ahead and give him a full force kick to the groin? I could just see that ending up in court with you being sued for ruining his ability to ever have children. What guy on that jury isn’t going to have sympathy for the drunk idiot?
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote blitzshlag:Yea, as someone who frequents bars I often wonder how Krav training would apply to a common scenario like a bar fight. Some drunk idiot gives you a good shove because he doesn’t like the way you glanced at his beer glass,…Every Thursday night, our training center conducts a scenario class. Various scenarios are run like your example. Other examples are someone accusing you of taking their parking space or maybe somebody cutting you off on the highway. Essentially, we role-play and the person playing the bad guy/gal conjures up a confrontational situation. De-escalation is emphasized. Itís fun and intense at the same time.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote greenbeanie:Every Thursday night, our training center conducts a scenario class. Various scenarios are run like your example. Other examples are someone accusing you of taking their parking space or maybe somebody cutting you off on the highway. Essentially, we role-play and the person playing the bad guy/gal conjures up a confrontational situation. De-escalation is emphasized. Itís fun and intense at the same time.this is the essence of modern self protection imo to much time is spent on training techniques for worst case scenario’s and next to no time actuelly training to descalating them or on body language so you can gauge the likely hood of an attack, unless someone jumps you from behind you should ever really need to get into a counter attack scenario if you train pre emptive striking.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
The “go list” is great. A couple of saturdays ago we ended up spending our entire fight class time (and then some) discussing real life scenarios and real life consequences based around our instructors personal experiences and those of other instructors/students that he has known. What it all boiled down to was this; you have little to no control over what will come about in court or what could happen as a direct result of your actions in the moment so you need to consider the worst case consequences and decide if while sitting in prison or a wheelchair 2 years later will you look back on the incident and say “I did what needed to be done.” or “Damn that was stupid.” The age old “was it worth it” consideration but done in advance of potential situations rather than after.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote Silas:The “go list” is great. A couple of saturdays ago we ended up spending our entire fight class time (and then some) discussing real life scenarios and real life consequences based around our instructors personal experiences and those of other instructors/students that he has known. What it all boiled down to was this; you have little to no control over what will come about in court or what could happen as a direct result of your actions in the moment so you need to consider the worst case consequences and decide if while sitting in prison or a wheelchair 2 years later will you look back on the incident and say “I did what needed to be done.” or “Damn that was stupid.” The age old “was it worth it” consideration but done in advance of potential situations rather than after.people dont go to prison for what thay do but what thay say!
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
I think the ‘Go List’ is a good start in the right direction. And I am certain that it would be beneficial in an investigation.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote MagaMike:I don’t care about the face. But I have the same issue with groin kicks. Groin kicking is off-limits in any recognized form of competitive fighting I’ve ever seen or participated in, so I’m hardwired never to even think of that.KM trains no-holds-barred self-defense, and rightly so. But I do need to work on my mindset more and really get used to thinking of the groin as a target option at all times.
i read a book about the OSS and their developement in the 40’s. The gentlemen who developed their particular fighting style, (I looked for the book but couldnt find it to provide his name) had great difficulty getting Americans to get over the “dirty fighting” techniques he employed. ie kicking or grabbing testicles, etc.
the book is Operative Spies and Sabatuers.
fun reading.
paul
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote Farhan:Now that I have your attention, I want my fellow Kravists to weigh in on something:I recently started KM (couple of months) and love it. One day our instructor was going over kicks and asked us to use our shins instead of feet. And then proceeded to show how you would kick someone in the face when they are on the ground doubled over from a hit to the groin. I without thinking said, ‘TO THE FACE?’ and every one stopped and looked at me and she said, ‘YES to the FACE, he/she is trying to kill you and you’re worried about their face?’
She came to me after class and said, ‘They chose to buy the ticket and they deserve a ride’. I understand it conceptually, but I don’t know if I will be able to put it into practice. Maybe if it’s a life threatening situation for me or my loved ones, it would change. I don’t know!
Now what I want to know is, if anyone else had/has the same sentiments, did you cringe at idea of disfiguring someone’s face? What do you do to remedy it?
Note: Leaving Krav is not an option.
Farhan,
Don’t think about it too much. Remember it’s Krav Maga and kicking people in the groin and face is required in a lot of defences. Just practice the technique until you are comfortable with it and eventually making that kick to the face as powerful and destructive as possible (on pads). Hopefully, you will never have to use it.
After a while, when you have learned the fundamentals, you can look for alternatives to face kicking if you still don’t like it. After the fundamentals, be creative and look for other and alternative weak spots to attack.
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
I will use whatever is needed to ge myself and my loved ones safe….right now that’s just my car but I love it…lol!
Seriously though I’m not training in Krav to say hmmmm……my life is in danger but could I go to jail or get sued???? Fuc# that, it’s on! First and formost I am going to do what we have all be trained to do, avoid the situation. If avoiding it is impossible then use the amount of force needed to get safe…if that means a boot to the head….well he is gonna get one. Remember Krav Maga is NOT A SPORT! :chair:
Re: Krav Maga and Sex
quote paul:i read a book about the OSS and their developement in the 40’s. The gentlemen who developed their particular fighting style, (I looked for the book but couldnt find it to provide his name) had great difficulty getting Americans to get over the “dirty fighting” techniques he employed. ie kicking or grabbing testicles, etc.the book is Operative Spies and Sabatuers.
fun reading.
paul
Fairbairn and/or Sykes?
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