Home Forums Krav Maga Worldwide Forums General KM Related Topics Stand up grappling in street fights – inevitable?

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 18 total)
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  • #29831
    anonymous
    Member

    When I was watching that boxer vs cop video on the other thread, I thought it was interesting to note that the boxer – who should have been used to keeping his distance in a fight – mostly held on to the cop, pushing and shoving him and only occasionally let go to try and land a punch. The cop was holding on to the boxer in a similar fashion.

    I’ve seen similar things in other fight videos, and I’ve also seen a real life fight once, where two huge guys were basically holding on to each other and pushing one another all across the street while yelling obscenities.

    Can we conclude from this that in most non-weapon fights, if the first few punches thrown miss their mark or fail to incapacitate either fighter, the two adversaries will likely continue their altercation tring to hold on to one another and, if that is so, should we pay added attention to stand up grappling to be prepared for that occurrence (and possibly attain an advantage in knowing more technique than the other person) in a street fight?

    _________________
    Giantkiller

    #51858
    h2h
    Member

    I like knees 😀

    #51860
    g-v
    Member

    For realistic training, I’ll take clinch sparring over kickboxing any day of the week. Elbows, knees, front kicks if you have stubby legs like moi, and last but not least, shredding your opponent’s face is what I’m talking about, yo.

    #51862

    Re:

    quote \”G.V.\:

    For realistic training, I’ll take clinch sparring over kickboxing any day of the week. Elbows, knees, front kicks if you have stubby legs like moi, and last but not least, shredding your opponent’s face is what I’m talking about, yo.

    Don’t forget a good ole HEADBUTT or two 😆

    #51866
    jl
    Member

    ah yes the good ol’ Headbutt! Brings back some fond memories..:twisted:

    #51869
    clfmak
    Member

    One form of sparring from a clinch I’ve done is by putting on heavy shin guards and going from a clinch position and kicking at each others shins. Various throws are also used. Its almost what’s shown in the middle of this clip:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qwe5DcOfhXg
    The low kicking can be a good way to set up throws, but you have to know when its safe to kick and when its a bad idea.

    #51870
    g-v
    Member

    Jah, good stuff on that Cestari clip.

    Headbutts generally don’t feel natural for me, so I don’t train them much.

    #51874
    unstpabl1
    Member

    I think, and this is opinion its more natural for a person to pull,grab or push first. Its probably the wrassling thang. Think of beginners and how suprising it is when you see these big athletic guys who can’t punch. It also seems that the probability of being grabbed,pulled or pushed goes up if your a women and as you get tired.

    #51876
    anonymous
    Member

    I think it would come very natural for someone to try and hold on to another person in a fight, probably in an instinctive attempt to control that person or also to defend the other’s punches (keep him at bay, or trying to hold on to the opponent’s arm, making it harder for him to punch). If you should ever find yourself in that position, having some good basic knowledge about how to fight from there would probably come in handy.

    Shin kicks are a good idea when in close. Makes me think of that crazy, obscure sport in Ireland or England, where two guys hold on to each other and then take turns kicking one another in the shin, until one of them collapses. 8) Don’t remember the rules exactly, just something I read about.

    _________________
    Giantkiller

    #51880
    unstpabl1
    Member

    Re:

    quote \”Giantkiller\:

    . Makes me think of that crazy, obscure sport in Ireland or England, where two guys hold on to each other and then take turns kicking one another in the shin, until one of them collapses. 8) Don’t remember the rules exactly, just something I read about.

    _________________
    Giantkiller

    Its called \”Dancing With The Stars\” 🙄

    #51925
    meangene
    Member

    Headbutts are great, aim for the nose!

    #51943
    kravmdjeff
    Member

    Re: Stand up grappling in street fights – inevitable?

    quote \”Giantkiller\:

    Can we conclude from this that in most non-weapon fights, if the first few punches thrown miss their mark or fail to incapacitate either fighter, the two adversaries will likely continue their altercation tring to hold on to one another and, if that is so, should we pay added attention to stand up grappling to be prepared for that occurrence (and possibly attain an advantage in knowing more technique than the other person) in a street fight?

    My humble opinion would be that it’s dangerous to try to conclude anything about \”most\” fights by analyzing any single fight. KM practitioners in general are already well-equipped to be prepared for that occurance because of the focus we give early on to elbow strikes, hammerfist strikes, and knee strikes. Remember-the object isn’t to \”outgrapple\” the attacker standing up. The object is to end the fight as quickly and safely (for us) as possible.

    #51947
    unstpabl1
    Member

    I agree with Jeff you can’t organize chaos as chaos by its very nature is disorganized. hell, look at my life 😯 However GK has described most of the concensual fights and taking time to look at the pathology of a fight is a smart thing to do. Having an idea, leads to a personal plan as long as you include flexibility and as Jeff has pointed out be prepared. Most fights have a buildup/interview. Most attacks,not all, an interview. The size of the attacker and sex may give clues as to intent. That TPI forum is a great resource for this kind of info. Stand up grappling is a very important piece to the puzzle. Also understanding the differences between a fight and an attack are important and one krav seems to address in the way the program is set up.

    #51949
    anonymous
    Member

    I wouldn’t judge all fights by just one single fight, what I observed concerned different fights. Of course, there are variables. Maybe there is a quick flurry of punches that knocks the other guy out right away. Or weapons are involved. But it seems to me that in situations that don’t involve a weapon and where the first few punches don’t win the fight, there may be a tendency for people to grab the other person, either to push that person away or to try and prevent him from throwing more punches (somehow controlling him).

    This could be an instinctive motion on the part of the attacker/defender, and if you found yourself in that type of situation, having some good basic idea about stand up grappling could give you a decisive advantage. You wouldn’t have to be an expert, but if you know well how to control/punch, possibly even take the person down from there (then remain standing, if you don’t want to go to the ground), it could help you win that fight, at least against a less experienced person.

    _________________
    Giantkiller

    #51951
    unstpabl1
    Member

    The clinch work in Muay thai, judo and wrestling are places I’ve been told to look at for standup. Underhook and swiming drills are great practice as well. I would think for you it maybe a great focus for awhile. I would think most people will think they can over power you. Notice I said THINK. GK, i tried to send you a PM ,but its disabled on this board… Nothing Weird 🙄 😀 Are you on anyother forum that has PM function? Did you sign up on the TPI board a while back as I’m on there and WT. THanks
    mike

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