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Assuming the details are factual, this is pretty interesting:
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
That was the most random, hard to follow video… sometimes the towel is on the floor, sometimes it is not… then the train is empty, then it is full… it is not in order, but edited all over the place… very strange. I would like to find an article that goes with it just to clear it all up.
It was interesting to watch his body language when he pulls out the folder and conceals it behind his arm… then the man that actually SEES him with it from behind but seems to say nothing. Its amazing how people will react differently when they see a knife compared to a gun…
The MMA seminar that Oneness is doing here in Aruba is in memory of a young MMA fighter that was in Holland studying to be an engineer. He came back to Aruba for summer break when somebody randomly attacked him with a knife , knowing he was into MMA and killed him… Very sad.
The edged weapon is a very intimate and deadly weapon that really commands more respect than it is given. Thanks for finding the vid. If anyone can find an article on this particular attack, please post.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
quote Kirsten:That was the most random, hard to follow video… sometimes the towel is on the floor, sometimes it is not… then the train is empty, then it is full… it is not in order, but edited all over the place… very strange. I would like to find an article that goes with it just to clear it all up.It was interesting to watch his body language when he pulls out the folder and conceals it behind his arm… then the man that actually SEES him with it from behind but seems to say nothing. Its amazing how people will react differently when they see a knife compared to a gun…
The MMA seminar that Oneness is doing here in Aruba is in memory of a young MMA fighter that was in Holland studying to be an engineer. He came back to Aruba for summer break when somebody randomly attacked him with a knife , knowing he was into MMA and killed him… Very sad.
The edged weapon is a very intimate and deadly weapon that really commands more respect than it is given. Thanks for finding the vid. If anyone can find an article on this particular attack, please post.
I agree that the video is edited like crap. I do think that the actual stabbing reinforces the notion that a sharp knife landed in the proper spot can seal your fate in less than a second.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
The murder we had here about two months ago was just like that – one single stab, one dead guy.
As Kirsten said, knives are scary. And everyone has one (or two…).
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
A couple more scary points:
If you look carefully at the beginning, you can see the attacker had his knife out already. He was just looking for trouble. The victim probably never saw the knife.
I also thought it was interesting that the attacker used the overhand attack a couple of times later on in the video. I hear so many Krav Maga critics claiming that “nobody ever attacks using icepick stab.” Well, this is at least the second video where I’ve seen somebody attack with overhead (icepick) stab.
Scary stuff.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
The murder I mentioned before was an icepick-style stab. As was the previous one, about three years ago.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
Here’s a link to the original story, published on the “El Pais” website (Spain’s largest newspaper):
http://www.elpais.com/articulo/espana/Punalada/mortal/metro/Madrid/elpepunac/20090510elpepinac_9/Tes
It’s in Spanish and there are two videos, one the long version and one that shows only the attack. Apparently, the attacker is a right-wing, anti-foreigner extremist who is using the subway to travel into a mostly immigrant area of town. He is wearing a T-shirt that identifies him as an extremist, with the words “Three Stroke”. So he might have been looking for trouble. He pulls out the knife as the train pulls into the station.
A group of young men get into the subway car and one recognizes the words “Three Stroke” on his sweatshirt and confronts him over it and gets stabbed and pushed out of the subway car.
After that, it’s chaos. The friends of the stabbing victim try to save his life on the platform, others simply get out of the subway car and the attacker gets trapped inside, surrounded by friends and supporters of the victim, who are on the platform. Some of them try to get back into the car from the outside and adjacent subway cars (where there are more people), to detain him. Another person gets stabbed by the attacker in the process.
Then, one supporter of the victim throws a fire extinguisher into the subway car where the attacker is trapped and it explodes, allowing the attacker to get out in the confusion (and under the cover of the smoke it produces). They all run after him.
In the end, he was caught and is now serving a 29 year sentence, 17 for killing the first person and 12 for attempted murder of the second victim.
Knowing this, the video suddenly makes a lot more sense. It’s all in sequence and if the subway car is sometimes empty and sometimes it isn’t, it’s probably because of people trying to get to the attacker from adjacent cars, while he is fighting them off. The whole thing is edited footage from about eight different cameras.
Hope this helps.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
Regardless of knowing, krav, that strike moved way to fast to defend. Also, they looked as though they knew each other.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
Have to agree with Dirty_Harry on that. Looks like the stab went directly to the victom’s heart. I think one of the main aspects of self defense was violated, that being distance. Create and maintain distance.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
quote Relli Kant:… The whole thing is edited footage from about eight different cameras.Hope this helps.
If you look carefully and anticipate the change in perspective it keeps flipping from a camera looking forward into the car where the attack took place, and then backwards into the empty car next to the first car, and it might be flipping again to look in a third car.
I did not understand the stabbing. If it is the spot where the first “tunnel vision” mode flipped on, it looked like he stabbed him in the shoulder. Did this kill by piercing the brachial artery?
I could not find a reference to the meaning of “three stroke” that made any sense in this context.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
I’m not familiar with “Three Stroke” either, but it may be an extreme right-wing organization known in Spain. One would have to google it to find out more. They also mention that the victim and some of the supporters were “antisistema”, apparently another kind of movement with an opposite ideology than “Three Stroke”, but I haven’t heard of them before either. The attacker was also Spanish military.
The article says that the stab entered the ventricle of the heart and was thus fatal. The victim might have lived for a few minutes, as some of the bystanders on the platform were said to have been trying to save his life.
The victim was 16 and the attacker 23. I don’t think they knew each other, but it appears the attacker was taking a train into the wrong neighborhood, wearing a provocative shirt, looking for trouble, ready to stab the first person who would confront him.
Later, he uses the knife to threaten or stab anyone who tries to get close to him, that’s why some of the people who are trying to enter the train and detain him ultimately back off, but then others appear to try again. One other person was stabbed in the shoulder, there is a detailed shot of that also (but hard to make out, it’s all so chaotic and fast).
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
Did some googling. Looks like “Three Stroke Productions” is a clothing firm started by an Italian neo-nazi, who has since sold it, but whoever owns the company now has shops in certain areas of Spain that cater to neo-nazis and sell fascist merchandise. Only fascists are wearing clothes bearing that symbol, that’s why the rather innocent-looking logo gave the attacker away. Here is a link to pictures and a story about shops that were vandalized and covered in graffiti in protest about ten months after the victim had died:
http://www.lahaine.org/index.php?p=32784
If you google “Three Stroke Productions”, you can also find links to the clothes, which are also sold in London. The logo looks perfectly ordinary and without knowing the background one wouldn’t think they’d be associated with neo-nazis. So, careful what you buy, I guess!
“Antisistema” seems to just generally refer to anti-government groups, extreme left or extreme right.
The victim has since become a symbol for all victims of neo-nazi violence.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
I saw a Three-Stroke clothes site that showed all the models riding scooters. I thought it had something to do with scooter engines, go figure.
Was the first stab the guy in the shoulder. I’ll have to watch it again.
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
Hello everybody.
I’m a Krav-Maga student since 8 months in Spain and this thread caught my eye. I’ll try to explain what happened in English the better I can.
First, you must understand the social context. In Spain, there is a constant fight between right-wing racists (nazi oriented) people against “anti-system” anarchists people (most of them are spanish too, they just don’t share the same opinion). This conflict is very active in the spanish society, since some “comunidades” (states) want their independence (catalunya, Pais Vasco…). Let’s just say the main conflict is “nazis” vs “anti system” people (For your understanding, it’s like KKK vs Black panthers for the Americans).
If you want to see the whole video, go here: http://www.elpais.com/videos/espana/Huida/grabacion/muerte/video/largo/elpepiesp/20090510elpepunac_2/Ves/
The aggressor was going to a xenophobic manifestation in a mostly foreigners neighborhood. The bunch of people you see at the beginning of the video are the “anti system” guys, who were going to the exact same location to disturb that manifestation.
The agressor, a soldier of the Spanish army, seeing all those “red” guys, pulls out a knife. He knows he’s going to get in trouble because of his shirt, a brand wore by nazi people. He has no chance of getting out without trouble. He cannot hesitate when the action comes, or he’s going to get beaten up really bad.
At the very beginning of the video, you can see he’s not expecting this: He yawns.
The “red” guy comes on the train, sees his shirt, says something to him as he recognizes the kind of guy he is. He gets stabbed very quick.
The aggresor stays on the metro, repelling the others attacks as quick and brutal as he can. Another guy gets stabbed on the flank.
A friend of the woundeds empty a fire estinguisher in the train. The aggressor takes this opportunity to run. He’s chased by a lot of people. He finally gets arrested the same day.
The trial begins this month, the attorney general requires 29 years.
I’m sorry for my english, I tried to explain the best I could. Don’t hesitate to ask anything you want to know, I’ll try to help!
Re: Want to see how quickly a knife can kill you?
here’s another similar incident of a neo nazi stabbing someone in the Czech Republic that we were sent. As you can see the people are running away into a building, the aggressor then follows them with a knife and one of the guys tries to attack him, gets a good few blows in and then sadly is stabbed and later dies.
We have very few guns in the UK so knives are the big threat and as such we learn knife defences quite early on in classes even though they aren’t tested until higher levels.
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