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I’m working more in my support job. Bunch of guys sitting around in a small area waiting to get called to up to work. They play cards, bullshit and watch tv. And we’re all competing against each other. Near fights happen alot lately, but usually don’t erupt fully, because both parties would lose the job.
Anyway, This kid lost some cash and was pissed at himself. So of course he took it out on someone else. Grabbed the seated guy by the chest, threatened him and rubbed the guys chin. I was sitting right next to it and had decided if it turned I was taking the kid(24) out. He has a temper. I’m 25 years older than the kid and the guy he grabbed is older than me by about 10. He’s never messed with me though.
I’ve had a couple thoughts on this, do you guys practice scenarios when seated. Definitely at a disadvantage.
I also thought seeing this kid is one of the few there that gets physical how I would’ve handled it. I’m usually not a fight starter and it takes alot to push me, specially as I got older. However, I think we teach people how to treat us. If I allow someone to put hands on me in any situation that gives them the courage to take it a step further the next time
Just looking for converasation on fighting from seated positions and when to or not to fight back
Re: Bully tactics
Just this morning at NTC we did some exercises working from a seated position, also with the disadvantaged positioned of being choked from behind a guard rail. Helped simulate the use of fighting with only your upper body.
As to deciding when to fight, you defend yourself when the situation calls for it, using the tools that are appropriate, whether that means talking to de escalate, or physical means if necessary. Whatever it takes to walk in peace, but with a clear mind , and sound decisions.
Re: Bully tactics
Interesting scenario… One thought that comes to mind is to reach out and grab his two little friends. As the saying goes, if you’ve got ’em by the balls, the heart and mind will follow…
Re: Bully tactics
quote stevetuna:“I won’t be wronged, I won’t be insulted, and I won’t be laid a hand on. I don’t do these things to other people and I expect the same from them.”
John Wayne, as John Bernard Books – The ShootistAs always check variables – apply violence as needed – rinse – wash – recycle
Re: Bully tactics
I noticed The Shootist quote as well. kind of sums up the second part of the question to me.
I don’t think the balls were an option in this case. The kid is tall so when and the chair bench high, so it would’ve been a reach. Only thing I coiuld think of was quick short hammer to nose so he could get up.. All leverage seemed on the side of the attacker
Re: Bully tactics
Years ago I was sucker punched while sitting in a Diner booth. For whatever reason I realized at the last second this guy was going to punch me (from my left) and was able to deflect the punch and bob away from it no different than if I was standing. His momentum took him onto the table and put me in the advantaged position of now standing on top having his coat over his head and all my weapons available and none of his. You’d be surprised how your every day training can come into play i the most unusual situations. What saved me was AWARENESS—-it was literally last second and would have been better sooner but it saved me.
Re: Bully tactics
Posturing is a big thing now-a-days, isn’t it? In a situation like your workplace environment it’s important to be ready for the attack and have in your head that the attack could occur…doing this, you will instintively look more ready and most people don’t want to attack someone that is “ready”.
I have always been told that 9 out of 10 people don’t want to fight, but I think that when someone is posturing to fight and the other guys steps up, the numbers are reversed…pride is a bitch, isn’t it!
Today I was seated when a guy started getting a bit loud and looking like it could escalate into something…I immediately closed the laptop in my lap and moved it to the counter so that I could defend if necessary…he saw the action and had to have realized it wouldn’t be as easy. Not sure if that was his deciding factor or not, but you never know.
Re: Bully tactics
quote CJs Dad:As always check variables – apply violence as needed – rinse – wash – recycleVery impressive, Sean!
But, do you do windows, too? rofl2
Re: Bully tactics
quote Miriam:Very impressive, Sean!But, do you do windows, too? rofl2
If theres one handy sure! That falls under apply violence as needed after checking variables.
Re: Bully tactics
I had an interesting situation from a seated position once.
I was approached by someone who I knew had a dislike for me. He had come with a couple of friends and I was with friends as well. I figured nothing would happen because of the Denny’s being very occupied. The he couldn’t be that stupid rule should have applied.
He was the problem but , brought it with him.
One of the friends threw a set of keys at me and being that my guard was already up I caught them as I moved. My reaction was a kick to the front of the knee from the seated position and his chin bounced off of the table top. No one noticed my reaction and when the police arrived the patrons had only seen him throw the keys and lose his balance.
On a side note:
They would have gotten away if they hadn’t handed me their car keys and had no way to leave, without leaving it there.Re: Bully tactics
quote unstpabl1:However, I think we teach people how to treat us. If I allow someone to put hands on me in any situation that gives them the courage to take it a step further the next timeI am an avowed lurker, but this quote compelled me to post. The reason is – I say it all the time! . . . although slightly different. I tell my son, my family, my friends – People will treat you the way you allow them to treat you. So it is nice to see that I am not the only one who says this.
To your question – I am a newly minted Level 3 so there is much I have to learn and experince in the system. I have not yet seen a specific technique or tactic from the seated position. Whenever I do see something for the first time, I try to go back to basics. The most basic thing, and the thing I learned on day 1: fighting stance. In the situation you described, I would be sitting in my fight stance. Right foot forward (I am a lefty) and on live toes. Weight on my toes and not on my butt. Then, if you feel you need to strike, I was thinking about the punch with advance. Instead of advancing forward, which I would do if I were standing, I would be advancing up and striking, whether it is the groin or the face. The strike may not be a knockout but at least I am now standing, in my fight stance and I have taken the initiative and will be following that opening strike with many more. That is my thought, FWIW, but as I said, I have much to learn still.
Good luck to you. Now back to lurking…..
Re: Bully tactics
During my bartending days long ago I came in contact with many waitresses. Bartenders and waitresses seem to hang out together off duty sometimes. One night a few of us guys and girls were sitting in the lounge where we worked. I was sitting next to one of our waitresses (she was a doll). There was nothing going on between us except our work relatinship. All of a sudden her husband burst in, standing over me and yelling something like “so you’re the son of a bitch that’s fu—– my wife.” It shocked the hell out of me – there really wasn’t anything going on between his wife and me. That was before I had any martial arts or Krav training. I thought this guy is going to kick my ass, or worse pull out a gun or knife. I held up one hand saying easy buddy, I don’t know what you are talking about. If someone’s fu—— you wife it isn’t me. At he same time I had my other hand in a fist ready to jump up and start swinging. The guy mumbled a bunch of obsenities and finally grabbed his wife and said let’s go. As she got up and they started to walk away he said to me “just stay away from my wife” or something like that. After he left I just sit there trembling and my adreline was about to burst out of my head and every one in the lounge was looking at our table. Aside from being embarrassed to hell, I thought ” Damn, I could have been shot or something”.
Re: Bully tactics
….I’m working more in my support job. Bunch of guys sitting around in a small area waiting to get called to up to work. They play cards, bullshit and watch tv. And we’re all competing against each other. Near fights happen alot lately, but usually don’t erupt fully, because both parties would lose the job.”…. the guy he grabbed …..and I had decided if it turned I was taking the kid(24) out.”
Wow!..are the rest of the guys at the table more the age of you & the victim or closer to the younger bully?Not being in a bar situation with booze involved,what kind of workplace has employees getting in repeated ‘near-fight’ situations?Most guys by that age have family responsibilities that would keep them from flying off the handle & losing their source of income.
When I was in college many years ago,I needed to work part-time during school,& full-time during summer in a plant near where I lived.One monday morning,I was working a drill-press when an older man deliberatly banged into me & challanged me to fight on the spot.He was a heavy drinker & hung over from the weekend.He hated college kids.I refused to fight on plant grounds,knowing full well the foreman would fire both of us immediately.
I needed the job.I told him I’d meet him after work in an adjacent field.During the day,I got ‘looks to kill’ whenever he walked by.An hour before closing ,he came by & apologized.I wonder if the bully fights with the other guy and you ‘take him down’;what happens when the police arrive?Can you legally do more than pull the bully off & restrain him if you yourself haven’t been threatened?If you land some knees & even knock the guy out,will the cops charge you for using excessive force?I’m sure there is some lattude there depending on the officer on the scene & what the ‘bully’ says.
Just wondering?
Re: Bully tactics
I had a strange situation today in a market, where the vender got a bit “over-enthusiastic” trying to sell me his goods, and at one point grabbed my arm while it was more or less at my side.
Virtually every single krav maga lesson we’ve done exercises on how to counter a wrist grab, but it was strange how it seemed completely different. On one hand though, I realized that he was not going to be aggressive and that he didn’t pose a threat, so I didn’t feel any need to counter his grab other than to talk to him, however I thought about how I would counter it if I needed and I kept feeling that my skills were rather inadequate (besides punching him or kicking or something, I mean to just release the grip and get him in a submission hold).
I find that too much of the Krav Maga I’ve been learning (beginning stages still) is with a “co-operative” and “limp” opponent, who’s standing there and letting you give him punishment. I really wish that we’d at some stage practise the moves with the opponent being as aggressive as possible to your defence, and trying with a lot of strength to counter you. Otherwise how do you know whether it’ll work in real life or if the guy can just tense his arm or something and you are helpless.
Re: Bully tactics
I have a good personality and can give and take a lot of ribbing and don’t take people to seriously. Especially what they say.
I always pay attention to what they do. Hand movements, getting to close etc….I try and walk away or avoid aggressive loudmouths if possible.
I went into a bar recently and overheard some dude bragging to his friends about his lack of fear and how he would “throw down wit anybody in here, big or small” for no apparent reason.
Makes no sense but some people get off on acting tough. The guy grabbing an older guy, that’s just wrong.
Bullies always pick on the weak, or those that are apparently weak anyway.
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