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GV, yes there are a few folks out there that do only the fighting to get ready for fighting. I think Karo might be one of those. However, look at the much larger group of athletes that do conditioning beyond their activity. I think it’s called general physical preparedness. Although I firmly believe that to get better at punching you punch, swimming you swim, there is a valuable piece of the puzzle that involves training conditioning your whole body. One way to look at it, in a fight, especially a street fight, you never know what muscle group you might have to use, it can go from punching to kicking to grappling to running. Furthermore, fighting all the time is pretty punishing on the body. For example, if one boxed all the time, no mitts, no bags, just punching, soon enough they will have no brain left. You can say similar to hand wear and tear, and other parts of the body. Somewhere, there is a balance. If your goal is self defense, then yes, that should be your focus with everything else just helping to develop attributes. If you feel that’s not what you’re getting, you can always mention something to the instructor. My students have given me feedback and I definitely appreciate it.
I had a buddy visit yesterday. He’s got some various martial art experience from the Russian army, kyokushin karate, and such. I was like, great, bring your gear. We did some stretching, and then jumped right into it…drills with a blast shield, some light sparring, some more blast shield work, more sparring (focusing on counters and combos), some bag work, etc. We spend like 2 hours at it, even took an Old Style break in between. We debated taking more of those breaks (complete with lighting up a few cigs), you know, to simulate the circumstances of a bar fight, but decided a beer each is realism enough. 😆
We didn’t do choke and bearhug defenses, but my stand-up game and stamina definitely improved with that 2 hour session in my garage.
As for situps, pushups, squats, lunges and all that….I did that in the morning, long before Ed showed up.
G.V. the logic you are using against a GPP program is faulty. It ignores the fact that the preponderance of people fighting and winning are actively involved in a GPP program. Secondly a sound GPP program should be structured in such a way as to allow more time for SPP.
Case in point, the GPP we do with our people is done in 30 minute classes. Weigh that against the guy who is in the gym lifting weights and running (poorly constructed GPP program) on the treadmill for 2 hours a day. My people have a lot more time to practice their striking and self defense than the other guy.Also, I question whether you might misunderstand the use of burpees, bastards and such in a KM class. At our place we constantly remind our people that the KM class is not a fitness class. The use of those exercises in drills is not intended to get someone in great shape (although it is a by product) but rather to help us simulate the exhaustion and disorientation of a street attack.
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All good questions indeed, Emil. Nu shto, where are u from, dude? I’m from Zhitomir, Ukraine, and just celebrated my 26th year here in the US. Thank you, mom and dad.
My opinion has always been that the cardio work is needed to help bring up your overall cardio strength to be able to handle warm-ups that are more striking intensive. Also, the cardio tends to work almost all the muscles in the body and get them loose for stretching so you are less likely to pull anything in class.
And doesn’t it make you feel better when you see even Bas Rutten needs to take a breather during his warmups?
I ride bicycles quite a bit and the last couple of years have been starting to get involved with triathlons, so when we started with a cardio section in my first KM class, I thought to my self, ìthis will be the easy partî.
After 10 minutes I was a little alarmed ñ I was thinking ìoh man, was I wrong about easy ñ gasp, gaspî, at 15 minutes my big breakfast started taxing the runway, at 20 minutes the cardio part mercifully ended (fortunately breakfast went back to the terminal). Then after a little stretching we started punching away at the pads, which was another workout all by itself.
After those first few session I was wiped out in the afternoon.
For my son, after experiencing the KM warm ups, gym class ìis deadî to him.
I would say the all over workout makes you more physically capable in all respects.
Considering KM’s first focus was for the Israeli defense force, having physically fit solders would naturally be part of the program.
Having learned our lesson now, we eat light before the class, perhaps 1 granola bar, and count on eating afterwards.
KMCat, I have heart through the grapevine that other Krav practitioners in other parts of the world (not sure about Israel) have observed a much higher priority on physical conditioning in US Krav than in other places in the world, leading them to think that it’s more of simply a workout routine to us rather than, first and foremost, a system of self-defense. It was implied in conversation I was in on that this led to the thought that we didn’t understand as much of the self-defense principles, but that we were simply interested in getting in shape.
I’m pretty sure instructors from the NTC helped them understand otherwise.
uh… how about 10 seconds of REAL fighting FEELS like an hour of simulated fighting…
If you can’t fight for \”pretend\” for an hour how will you fight for real (with someone actually trying to kill you) for 3-5 minutes. (yes a fight could last that long)
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quote \”KravMDjeff\:KMCat, I have heart through the grapevine that other Krav practitioners in other parts of the world (not sure about Israel) have observed a much higher priority on physical conditioning in US Krav than in other places in the world, leading them to think that it’s more of simply a workout routine to us rather than, first and foremost, a system of self-defense. It was implied in conversation I was in on that this led to the thought that we didn’t understand as much of the self-defense principles, but that we were simply interested in getting in shape.I’m pretty sure instructors from the NTC helped them understand otherwise.
The warm ups I have experienced always integrate some aspect of fighting skill, like running in differing positions (sideways, backwards, not just forward, plus switching modes — I assume this is teaching being able to move around while fighting in an agile manner), shadow boxing while running, getting down on the ground doing push ups , getting up and continue running (simulates getting pushed or knocked down?).
A few years ago my sister-in-law was dating a guy that had a black-belt in Karate. Along with my family, we were all at local amusment park that had a water slide ride that involved a long hike up some stairs to the top. At the top the black-belt guy was really out of breath. I always wondered about the utility of being a black belt and not having any significant stamina. I guess you would have to count on winning on the punch, but you might be in trouble if you did not.
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