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Why are Krav tests so long? Seems they are 4-5 hours. Is this standard throughout KMWW?
I cant help but wonder (in all arts not just Krav) how students can go through 30 classes with instructors and the instructors need a test to determine if said student is ready.
I think the future (which is already here) is leaning towards no belts, no ranks and no tests. KM has done a great job for the most part. Jeet Kune Do does as well. Obviously MMA is the most advanced in this area…but Judo and BJJ still hold their traditional testings and ranks.
Can anyone give the reasoning? Im sure KMWW has a very good idea of what they beed since, in my opinoion, KMWW is near perfect. It’s this one issue I cannot grasp.
Re: KM Tests
I don’t have a reasoning on the belt system. But I know alot of Krav places hold a workshop first (2 hours) covering everything on the test, and then 2 hours for the actual testing.
When I ranked up we did no workshop and my test was about 3 hours. 1 hour of cardio/conditioning/burn-out and then 2 hours of technique and drilling.
Krav is about mental fortitude and attitude, if you can fight through pain/weakness and being tired to overcome then your most likely going to carry that principal with you in a real fight.
Plus when you’re tired you can’t think as well and thats when flaws in technique become obvious.
Re: KM Tests
Hello,
Although we do not wear belts in class, we have the test from one level to the next to be sure the foundation is being built for students learn quickly and move to the next level safely.
You are right that as an instructor I know when my student is ready to move to the next level before testing them. But they may not know that. By going through such a physically and mentally demanding test they become empowered. Seeing the growth that happens to each person during and after a test is amazing. It is not just about the technique. it is about the mind set to continue even if you are mentally drained and knowing that the techniques work when you are not well rested and feeling great. Also the sense of accomplishment after enduring something so demanding is invaluable.
To continue this growth the amount of stress in each test increases to match level of the system.
I hope this helps with your understanding of how and why we do belt test.Re: KM Tests
I may be wrong here, and I often am, but I don’t recall the belt system starting until early 1900’s as a way to bring in foreigners to the martial arts. I know level existed but not the flashy belts that we have now.
As for Krav I seem to remember the founder and ground breakers writing that they used belts just because its always been that way but I think they soon moved away since it really is hard to justify belts when you are constantly improving from battle experience. Like it stopped translating after awhile
But take that all with a grain of salt…..I’ve read so much that it might be all jumbled in my thick head.
Re: KM Tests
quote KMMAN:Why are Krav tests so long? Seems they are 4-5 hours. Is this standard throughout KMWW?I cant help but wonder (in all arts not just Krav) how students can go through 30 classes with instructors and the instructors need a test to determine if said student is ready.
.When I was attending class we didn’t always have the same instructor depending on the day(s) you went. I also saw some pretty large classes at times and while I think most instructors have a good idea of the students strengths and weakness, it may be hard to have a comprehensive or total picture of that students ability.
I’m not clear on the testing criteria or the standardization of such tests, but I would think it would help keep continuity throughout the Krav Maga schools. Just my 2c.
I look forward to a day I can actually test. I workout mostly at home with vids but can afford to train for shortened periods (a couple/few months at a time) and hope to test in the future.
Re: KM Tests
The only person to move away from the belt system was Eyal Yanilov and I assume it was his influence and friendship with Darren that the KMWW level system came about since they both happened around the same time. All the other KM schools in Israel still use the belt system and wear them.
I like the belt system for many reasons but I am not too sure how I feel about testing.Some of my belts I tested for and some were just awarded to me. I felt the same sense of accomplishment for all of them. The same goes for my BJJ blue belt which was not tested for…in fact most BJJ schools dont belt test. Belts are awarded by the instructor as he sees fit. I am still up in the air about whether I will formally test my students or not.Re: KM Tests
I (we) was once told by a TKD Master that, way back in the good old days, all belts were white. As the student progressed through the years and training got harder and the fighting (sparring if you will) got more intense, the belt got dirtier and bloodier and its color turned darker and darker. Eventually giveing the appearance of being black.
Don’t know how true that is, but it sounded cool anyway.
Re: KM Tests
I for one like the belt system. I also like the idea of a brutal belt test. I never felt like I earned the belts I achieved in TKD because the testing was so easy and everyone passed.
Re: KM Tests
“Origin:
The systematic use of belt color to denote rank was first used by Kano Jigoro, the founder of judo, who first devised the colored belt system using obi, and awarded the first black belts to denote a Dan rank in the 1880s. Initially the wide obi was used; as practitioners trained in kimono, only white and black obi were used. It was not until the early 1900s, after the introduction of the judogi, that an expanded colored belt system of awarding rank was created. Other martial arts later adopted the custom or variation on it (e.g. using colored sashes) to denote rank including in arts that traditionally did not have a formalized rank structure. This kind of ranking is less common in arts that do not claim a far eastern origin.Misconceptions
One common idea concerning the tradition of belts claims that the belt ranking system is an ancient aspect of traditional martial arts and that early martial artists began their training with a white belt, which eventually became stained black from years of sweat, dirt, and blood. In fact, Japanese Koryu instructors tended to provide certificates and, given the standard of cleanliness common in a traditional dojo, a student arriving with a bloodied or dirty uniform might not be allowed to train.
In some arts and schools there is the (often only half-serious, though equally often rigorous) opinion that the belt should not be washed; by doing that one would “wash away the knowledge” or “wash one’s ki away” might be related to this myth. Apart from risk of the dye running, there is the problem that as most modern belts are made with a cotton or nylon outer shell, but polyester batting and stitching to fill out the belt, the different shrinkage of cotton and polyester in hot water could cause the belt to come apart.”Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_belt_(martial_arts)
Re: KM Tests
As my friend Kevin Mack explains, all KM schools in Israel still wear belts. I don’t know about Yanilov, but I did train in one of the schools that belonged to the same group as Yanilov’s (association or federation? I always forget). And we wore belts there.
In my opinion the removal of belts from the attirre is just a publcity move by Darren and his KMWW schools to attract more adult crowds. Because, as adults, we feel stupid wearing coloured belts, like kids.
The belt tests in Israel don’t only test for endurance and fighting spirit but mostly also for techniques. They do not last 3 hours though. What you get is probably a separate instructor assigned just for the people being tested. During a regular class he takes them aside and while the rest train normally, he tests them on techniques and knowledge first. Then, when the general class is about to finish, the people being tested are expected to spar against higher ranking KM students and instructors to show off their resolve. This is at least my own exprience in Israeli schools. I have tested through green belt.
Re: KM Tests
IKMF, Eyal’s organization, does not have belts anymore. A patch system has been developed. There is much chatter about the length of a test and the material which is on the test. Curriculum aside I think the test should require the student to perform the techniques associated with the level. There should always be some sort of weapons component and then an unknown factor. The student should be placed in an unfamilliar situation. What should be graded is the students ability to follow the principles of Krav Maga and create the answer to the problem.
The cardio stuff is ok but not if it is not related directly to Krav Maga techniques.
Re: KM Tests
Maybe Im sadistic, but I feel the harder the test and the pain and suffering I go through to pass it just means Ill be confident in my abilities when the **** hits the fan. From what Ive seen your’e tested harder than that in a shorter period in a real fight.
But I will concede that is mostly mental anguish you suffer when you get jumped by 4 guys and have the crap kicked out of you. your pride takes longer to heal than a few bruises.
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