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Three times in the last two weeks I’ve had a partner pull the pad back as I throw a straight punch and wound up hyper-extending my elbow. The third time it happened it was actually done at the last minute, deliberately, and I had no time to adjust; this particular guy told me he was trying to help me learn to adjust to a moving target.
I realize that in a real situation the target does not stand still, so how does one avoid this kind of injury. We have been learning to drive through the target when we punch, but in my case doing so is how I wound up hurting myself. Do I need to condition myself to punch to a certain depth and stop at that point even when the target has moved? I can’t develop nearly as much power when I do, but maybe that can be improved with training?
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
Adjust to a moving target? WTF? You need stop training with this a-hole. Last time I checked, safety in training was paramount. Why don’t you walk up and kick him in the balls and then tell him that you were trying to help him by conditioning his groin to pain as he lays writhing in agony…..You really need to talk to your instructor so that they can address this to the entire class.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
Gotta love those enthusiastic training partners. Although he does have a point and a real fight is organic in that its perpetually in motion “tricking” you does not adhere to our safety in training mantra.
Distance continuum is a realistic consideration as such you do indeed need to compensate for variables.
If it was me and I knew my partner had a propensity to move the pad I would increase my odds by moving closer to the target.
Remember you can move faster forward then he can move backwards.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
This was not with the same partner each time, only the last time was deliberate, and I did tell each of them that they needed to hold the pad in place. I will follow your advice to talk to the instructor as well. Good partnering is actually covered in class fairly regularly, but we have a pretty steady stream of newcomers and maybe it doesn’t always get through to them.
Anyway…, being relatively new to the whole fighting/self-defense thing, I’m still curious about how one avoids this kind of injury when striking at a moving target in a real fight. Although apparently new to KM, the guy who moved on me deliberately appeared to have some skills as a fighter, which I do not, and so I wondered if there was some merit to his comment/intent.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
quote Jeremy Stafford:Adjust to a moving target? WTF? You need stop training with this a-hole. Last time I checked, safety in training was paramount. Why don’t you walk up and kick him in the balls and then tell him that you were trying to help him by conditioning his groin to pain as he lays writhing in agony…..You really need to talk to your instructor so that they can address this to the entire class.rofl2
Totally true and spoken from an instructor! Thanks Mr. Stafford
From my spot on the bottom of the totem pole I am in line with Mr. Stafford. A moving target in a fight is real life and there is no getting around that. Everyone here can agree to that.
I think most instructors have time set aside for moving punches as well as static punch time. Its not up to this sparring partner to take it upon himself to determine what you should be doing. That type of malignant communication is what gets people hurt during training class.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
were they holding the target against their chest? i’ve seen beginners hold the target at arms length which can easily end up with the striker hyperextending the arm, but if they are holding the pad correctly (against their body) it should make it much more difficult to hyperextend the arm. whenever i work with a new person, and they are holding away from their body, i stop punching and tell them to hold against the body so i don’t hurt myself and so they can get use to getting punched.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
Are you very strong?
I am going to go out on a limb and guess you punch very hard. Most of the time I see people back off it is because they are absorbing more of a punch through the pad than they prefer. I know a few people have knocked me around like I was nothing (not that I am something).
I suspect they are scared or hurt and are moving away from you. I think it was ego that made that person say he was training you in that way vs. admitting you were hurting him.
I could be wrong.
Dave
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
quote parishd:This was not with the same partner each time, only the last time was deliberate,.sounds like one person might have infected the whole class! every so often we get the lecture about holding firm and not moving the pad so WE don’t cause a hyperextended knee or elbow, i did it to myself once on a interferance drill about 2 months ago and i still have a little pain(i reached aroud the guy to hit the pad)
this person won’t help you train by doing that, if anything it will hurt your training, you won’t punch hard or fast so you won’t hurt yourself and in doing so you wont train correctly
practice wont make perfect..perfect practice will make perfect application!
just my opinion
russellRe: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
I’ve encountered pads not being held correctly before, but in these cases the pad was being held against their chest(s) correctly.
Thinking about it more…
The first two times my partner was falling back as a result of my left when my right came up short. I think I should probably be able to anticipate this and should have moved in as suggested by Sean. The third time the person absorbed my left without moving and then slid slightly back as my right was in midflight. In this case, without the pad I think it would have been difficult to absorb the blow without at least some backward movement, which again might make moving in the proper response.
Edit: Dave, I don’t know if I’d call myself very strong, but as you can see I was basically coming to the same conclusion in this post as yours came up! Great minds eh!
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
Lol – A few weeks ago we were doing chokes and the instructors demonstrated the defense and its where you swing down around and whack you’re attacker in the nuts. Well the new student I got stuck with took in literally and whacked me full speed. Lucky I was wearing my “Balls of Steel” cup, thank god!
DS314
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
Not only do I hold pads so they can hit them hard; I’ve also learned to meet their force with some of my own, actually moving slightly into the strike when holding focus mitts, thai pads, and kicking shields. This is good for the safety of both people and offers good resistance, and has allowed me to take full power strikes on the pads from people a lot bigger than me (and I’m not a small guy). When using a trainer type chest protector or a kicking shield, I also make sure to exhale sharply as the strike hits me, but with especially powerful people I’ll stay light on my feet and allow the kick to move me around a little to absorb some force.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
As far as how to avoid hyperextending your elbow when not hitting a pad, I would say to stay relaxed, focus on good form, and focus on getting your power from the turning of the body, not the extension of the elbow.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
My advice. First, if this happens in real life, you don’t mind taking one for the team. When you are practicing, you shouldn’t have to feel like you’re going to get injured why learning to protect yourself.
Like Mr. Stafford said work on the groin protection and if he continues to move. He won’t go far from the floor.
Re: Straight punches and hyperextended elbow
Mm… I actually usually don’t get close to extended my elbow completely when punching. I’m like to get in nice and close and throw my whole body into a punch and pretend to go right through the target. Usually ends up with a really strong strike and a slight bend left in the elbow. I don’t even give my partner the chance of injuring me.
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