What would you do in this situation??

[usnavy-233]

I had a co-worker ask me today what I would do if someone came up to me, either directly behind or just off to my side and put a knife to my throat while I’m sitting in my chair at my desk. Don’t worry, he was being completely hypothetical 😉 . I thought about it and with my limited Krav experience, here’s what I came up with.

First, I’d pluck the knife hand down and try to trap it between my forearm and bicep (think carry but in the opposite direction). At the same time I would reach back and rake his face with my other hand, hoping to get a finger jab to the eyes. I would also push off my desk with my legs to create enough space to stand up and turn into the guy.

Once I’m standing up its game on! I would first get positive control of the knife hand by using my free hand (non-carry side) to trap his wrist then shift his arm out of my modified carry so both my hands could cup/pin/twist/break his knife hand. From there it would be multiple kicks and knees until he was incapacitated enough to safely remove the knife.

Thoughts I considered were:
It may still be possible for the guy to stab me in the chest however, if I’ve got his forearm trapped, he won’t have much leverage or force so any cuts I receive to the chest area will be fairly superficial. Also, the possibility exists to get cut on the shoulder/collar bone while conducting the pluck. This might be a little worse of a cut than the chest cuts after I trap the arm, but at least itís not a cut to my artery or throat.

Thoughts?? What would you do differently? Can you think of a better way to handle that situation?

Thanks.

[anonymous]

If he is directly behind you, you could probably pluck the knife down, then hold on to it and pin it to your chest with both hands, keep it in place, then get up and either duck underneath his shoulder (as regular knife from behind to throat), or maybe roll toward him and kick, keeping a strong grip on the knife. If he is to your side, you may be able to simply redirect the knife arm forward and into him, while getting up and punching. Or pluck it to the side and down, then use the other hand to get a cavalier and kick.

Sitting down or lying down while being attacked are all interesting scenarios. Would be cool to work on them more often.

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Giantkiller

[clfmak]

I remember in a seminar with Eyal we were going over knife against the throat from behind techniques, and in one instance he grabbed the arm and jabbed thin knife into the face of the attacker. This may work depending on the dynamics, but the point would probably hit something other than the face.
My first thoughts: If you’re at your desk, control the arm with your left hand and stab a pencil, pen etc into the groin or inside thigh with your right hammerfist, then continue combatives as you turn towards them, using an arm drag as you pivot. If arm drag works, pressure the arm towards them and knee their arm to try to impale them. If you create enough space, turn and grab your chair for use as a shield or bludgeon. If something doesn’t work, obviously you’ll have to change it up.

[clfmak]

If the pen is still in your hand, you could continue using that also.

[unstpabl1]

Probably not what you want to hear and I know i’m playing the devils advocate here, but i would never tell a coworker anything about self defense skills unless they made a mistake and put their hands on me :shock:,then as they pummeled me I’d yell I know Karate 🙄 😆 Though this comes from expirience as people with that kind of info either always try to test you or try to put you in the middle of crap you don’t need to be in the middle of. You have the added weight because of your Elite status. I know their your friends and you trust them,but remember Phil Hartman trusted his wife. OUCH,sorry. you live in Virgina,if I recall. For knife stuff,Tom Sotis of Amok does seminars in the area, the guys I know who recommend him in the area are hi speed, low drag and think very highly of Krav Maga. KravJeff should know of whom I speak. Though Its hard not to talk about an activity thats so cool. I know. 🙂
mike

Is Manassas Close?

[clfmak]

People won’t try to test you if your response to their hypothetical scenarios is \”I’d shoot you\” or \”I’d stab you\”.

[unstpabl1]

😆 😆 😆 Or better yet stab em’ first, then ask \”What was your question again? 😈 \”CLFMak, How have you been? Dog Brothers Gathering Is in June in case your thinking of checking it out. Where hav you been hiding?
mike

[clfmak]

I’ve been around, just not posting much. Lately its been lots of discussion about ranks, patches etc and I don’t have much to say. I’ll definitrly try to make it to the Dog Brothers gather in June.

[unstpabl1]

Re:

quote \”CLFMak\:

I’ve been around, just not posting much. Lately its been lots of discussion about ranks, patches etc and I don’t have much to say. I’ll definitrly try to make it to the Dog Brothers gather in June.

Hopefully. I’ll get to go this time as well. They’re looking for a new venue so Spike TV can shoot it. They were set to do it for the last one but at the last moment the gym wouldn’t allow it. When it gets closer I’ll post it for you. THe date is posted on their web site

[usnavy-233]

Re:

quote \”unstpabl1\:

Though this comes from expirience as people with that kind of info either always try to test you or try to put you in the middle of crap you don’t need to be in the middle of……

Is Manassas Close?

His question was based on the fact that he’s an Aikido student and I’m a Krav student. He was only wondering how someone with Krav training would handle the scenario vice an Aikido guy. I’m quite certain I don’t have to worry about him testing me OR putting me in an akward situation.

Manassas isn’t too far from me at all.

[unstpabl1]

My understanding is Amok (Tom Sotis) is doing a seminar there in Febuary and another in June. You can look him up on the net. It will compliment the krav. I can get you the dates and the number in Manasas for the particulars if your interested. Amok is about the knife and Sotis is pretty highly recommended. And I trust my sources on him. I also think there is a pretty good combat handgun seminar ( as in great) there soon. I think KravJeff would recommend the instrustor as you may know Jeff better than me. It seems Manasas is a hot bed of good training 😀

I was playing devils advocate. I’ve read your posts. I know you have your head screwed on tight 🙂 But seriously, how can you trust an aikido guy, they all think O’sensei could throw them without touching them and disappear. 🙄 🙂 Takle care. Oh yeah, yours and P1 advice helped alot with keeping the feet dry. thanks

[vicious]

we’ve probably trained knife threats while seated more often then most schools… as long as you \”lock on\” after you pluck, you can simultaneously stand up AND rotate under the arm holding the knife… just try to get the foot furthest from the knife to outside so you get around the chair instead of tripping on it.

now defending while at a desk would be harder… youíd have to ìtalkî your way into getting your legs out from under the desk before attackingÖ

[anonymous]

Okay, this reminds me now, one time in Jarret’s old LV5 class, we were doing a drill where somebody attacked from the front while the other person was seated. Now, I’m not sure anymore if this involved a weapon or not, might have been just a kick directed at the seated person. Anyway, in defense one would fall back while still seated on the chair, do a back roll, then get up, grab the chair and use it as a shield against the attacker. That was pretty darn cool, but we only did it once, so unfortunately I don’t remember the details of it.

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Giantkiller

[usnavy-233]

Re:

quote \”unstpabl1\:

My understanding is Amok (Tom Sotis) is doing a seminar there in Febuary and another in June…..Oh yeah, yours and P1 advice helped alot with keeping the feet dry. thanks

I’ll dig up some info on that. Sounds like a good time.

As for the feet, glad to hear the recommendations are working out well for you. For such a small part of the body, feet can sure make the rest of you miserable when they’re not treated right.

[chris]

I would ask him for his T-81 report and tell him the boss expects it on his desk shortly.

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