- This topic has 21 replies, 14 voices, and was last updated 15 years, 9 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Little bit about my background i was never interested in martial arts until i discovered krav i thought they could teach you how to fight well in a ring but lacked any realism when it came to street fighting.
I was more interested in swords been collecting replicas for 6 years & training by my self mostly & with a mate sometimes if i could convince them i wouldnt cut their head off :abx:.
I took fencing for a year before i decided it wasnt really for me, the swords to me werent based enough on historical examples (weight etc) & i found the rules regarding fencing prohibitive & unrealistic.Ended up discovering krav & been doing it ever since, now im not knocking krav i think its awesome but i think if you went barhanded against someone who truly knew how to use a knife your in for alot of trouble.
I havent done any formal knife training so i utilize wot i know swordwise & apply it when i use a knife & i have found that alot of people training struggle to defend against me when im given freedom to do wot i want, even the more experienced students.
However i still think krav as a street based defence system is ace as when are you likely to come up against someone who really knows how to use a knife?
So question is do any people in your schools know how to use knives & if so how do you find your krav skills hold up to defending against them?
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
“Going barehanded against someone who knows how to use knives”
It has been my experience that knife wielding aggresors do not use what they “know”. They don’t have to. They have a knife and you don’t. So it sounds like your describing a fight and not self defense. If you will “fight” a person with a knife barehanded you will be cut. Regardless of the knife holders skill set you will catch the blade. So why would you be in this “fight”?
Krav is not a style vs style system. It is a defense system. A defense predicated on an agressive attacker not a knife fighter. Two totally different arenas. Incidentally the way to defeat a knife fighter is to pull out the Glock and tap three shots. Two in the chest, one in the face!
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
If the guy has a knife and knows how to use it….your screwed. Your gonna get cut up. If they throw repeated stabs and slashes it will be very hard to execute a knife defense. To me going up against a knife is scarier than a gun.
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
Look, knife, to me, is the scariest thing, but you’re not screwed. People survive knife attacks all the time, with no training.
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
Oh, and as for people “who know how to use knives”, they are likely in prison or have been. Those are the really scary ones.
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
I was told a great piece of advise along time ago that serves as my fundamental attitude towards bare hand vs weapon
1) If they have a gun, fight (and thanks to Krav I know how). The thought is they can shoot several rounds and are likely to hit you.
2) If they have a knife, just run. They can throw it at you but then they do not have a knife.
As always, there is about 100 different ways to get attack with a weapon so that principle can not always apply.
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
While I appreciate the sentiment, it’s not much in the way of advice. Most people can and will run, if given the opportunity, and you don’t need training for that. The training is for when you’re cornered, injured, with your family, faced with multiples, etc.
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
Anyone going into a knife fight thinking they won’t get cut is a fool at best, possibly dead, at worst. By learning correct techniques, you get to choose where and how deep you get sliced. I’ve been taking Combative Tactics for about 8 months now and we’ve trained offensive and defensive knife attacks, off and on for the last few months. The guy who teaches it was a bodyguard for 12 years, taught CT to military and corporate security for years. There are a million different ways to defend against a knife- some of which are used in Krav. Are there better ways? Yeah, of course. Isn’t there always?
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
Clearball,
There is a Knife based system called AMOK! you should look into.
Tom Sotis is the founder and it is REALLY BIG in South Africa. The Gardian Angles have adopted it as their standard in SA. There are a few places where you can get training but Tom travels extensively doing seminars.
You can find it at http://www.edgedweaponsolutions.com/
If you carry a folder this is the system to teach you how to use it. It’s the best knife combatives system I have seen. I have attended Tom’s seminars and use it as a complement to Krav. Anytime Tom is in my area I take advantage of the opportunity to train with him.
The seminars usually end with a seudo-tournament where you do full speed Force-on-Force sparing. Really cool stuff……
If you think 360 defense is hard on the forearms, just imagine 2 full days of 360 defense. I recently did a 2 day seminar with Tom over a weekend and we did 360 the Monday after. My forearms were hamburger….:OhMy:
Hope this Helps.
CCB
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
OK
It seems I start out with most of my posts this way but I have been training with knives for a number of year and have to jump in. I have heard people say they would rather fight a gun than a knife, and I understand what they are thinking. If a guy points a gun at you, via KM, or some other techniques, you take it from him/her and you hit them with it or point it at them etc. etcÖÖ. If someone is slashing at you, it is hard to defend.
Here is the problem with that. IF someone wants to kill you with a gun, he, or she levels it, and pulls the trigger. You are dead. You have no defense. You canNOT take the gun away. You are simply dead. IF someone threatens you with a gun, he/she wants more of you than for you to be dead. (e.g. a wallet maybe.) IF someone threatens you with a knife, e.g., holds it to your throatÖ.. You can take it away easily with KM technique. It is no different than a gun. It is a pointy object that needs to be taken from the offending party. Simple as thatÖÖÖÖ.. .
If someone is slashing at you with a knife, you are going to be cut. But, then, you will probably not be killed, and chicks dig scars. (OK, I dig scars on women too, but that is a whole different subjectÖ..)
There are VERY few places you can be slashed and then die. In general, the knife wielding perp has to stab you to kill you. Stab defenses, overhand or under, are well taught in KM.
Thatís all I have for now.
JamesRe: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
Couple of things I will add.
With the exception of Hollywood movies and the occasional brandishing lunatic a good percentage of the time you are not aware you’re in the knife fight until you are IN the knife fight.
Typically the fight starts out as mutual combat and then escalates to a higher level of force.
It’s a good training tool to introduce in a multiple attacker scenario where hypothetically your in the middle of a technique or combatant series and all you see is the overhand swing of a 2nd attacker. Or you are making the defense and the knife comes out and you’re forced to reevaluate on the fly.
And yes we train with people who are well versed in knife from other styles all the time. In fact just the other night BrentW handed me my lunch while I was trying to carve him up. It didn’t go so well for me 🙂Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
My center’s instructors are VERY well trained in the use of knives and defending against them. I can hear Pete’s voice in my head when I remember how he (as well as the other instructors) always tell us to accept the fact you’re GONNA get cut. It’s not a question of if.
Hmm – saw our new schedule for this month and we’re gonna be having a 3/4/5 class. I wonder if I’ll get to see the infamous shock knives I keep reading about.:D:
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
quote Psyops:“Going barehanded against someone who knows how to use knives”It has been my experience that knife wielding aggresors do not use what they “know”. They don’t have to. They have a knife and you don’t. So it sounds like your describing a fight and not self defense. If you will “fight” a person with a knife barehanded you will be cut. Regardless of the knife holders skill set you will catch the blade. So why would you be in this “fight”?
Krav is not a style vs style system. It is a defense system. A defense predicated on an agressive attacker not a knife fighter. Two totally different arenas. Incidentally the way to defeat a knife fighter is to pull out the Glock and tap three shots. Two in the chest, one in the face!
Ah, yes. One of the many perks of being in Nevada & not Kalifornia.
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
I have used a knife for a long time. I can cut my own food. I rarely hurt myself with it.
Re: Anyone trained with people who know how to use knives?
“IF someone wants to kill you with a gun, he, or she levels it, and pulls the trigger. You are dead.”
Sorry, FFDO, but the stats just don’t support your claims. According to the FBI:
-Subjects shot, 10% die from their wounds
-Subjects stabbed, 30% die from their wounds
Besides this, the mentality of someone willing to use a knife is very different than that of one using a gun (which is a distance weapon.) Someone with a knife is willing to get close. They are willing to get messy. They are willing to feel tendons and muscles. They are willing to take a piece of steel and plunge it into the body of another human. This is very different than someone with a gun.
Look, is a gun a deadly weapon? Of course, it is. That said, gun’s fail. Gun’s run out of ammo. It’s easy to miss with a gun. A gun is much easier to control, from the defender’s perspective, than a knife. I’ve never seen a knife fail. A knife is always live, and as Sean said, it is difficult to see.
Just my opinion.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
