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Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
quote Ryan:Just a quick note…using inside defenses and 360s for “fighting” in the context given here will get you hammered.Yup. I thought I was being “KM friendly” with this but that is correct. Better to avoid the strikes or if blocking punches paw the jab and cover the hooks, shin block the kicks etc.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
quote :Don’t wait for openings, create them.Great advice!
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
ND, I understood what you were saying, but based on what seems to be the nature of this class, if he starts extending his limbs, he’s going to get blasted.
Thanks, Kirk. “Waiting” for openings is a horrible idea. By the time you recognize it, it is gone. It is imperative to create openings through fakes/feints, overloading the high line, level changes, etc.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
Unfortunately, a lot of the elements to fighting are really learned…while fighting. I encourage you to keep doing it as much as possible. If at all possible, try to keep the fight as realistic as you can. What I’ve appreciated about KM so far is that it’s so aimed at realism. In a fight you have adrenalin going, you’re getting tired fast, you’re tense, you’re getting hit, nothing’s working perfectly and the actions that you do are reactions to reactions to reactions. The only way to be effective in these situations…is to be used to them.
Get the gear that works for you the best and then train a bit on your own while wearing it. I remember when I first started sparring, what bothered me the most wasn’t the other guy…it was the cup and the head gear! Suddenly, I had to adjust how I moved, and my sight picture was totally different. Then the adrenalin, the shock of getting hit, and the sheer fatigue started making my body work completely differently from during normal training. It was only after those things became “normal” for me that I was able to really start using the things that I’d already had trained into me. It’s the same reason that teachers test their students before the end of the year tests…the students have to be used to the format. Drills and practice are essential to learn technique. You have to break things down into their component parts to really learn them. But, then you have to be able to apply them in as close to real world conditions as possible before they can actually become useful to you.
Fight as much as they will allow you to, and the results will become apparent.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
Of course, like anything, the more you do it, the better you should get at it. That said, when it comes to fighting, if you’re getting lit up every time, it can be rather frustrating and demoralizing. Also, doing something “wrong” over and over just makes you better at doing something wrong.
Don’t get me wrong, at the end of the day, you just have to get in there and work, especially with fighting, but some ways are simply better than others.
Go in with one or two goals per session, and try to focus on just those goals.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
Also,
Keep your attacks simple. Be linear not circular. Throw straights. Throw round kicks to the lead leg of the attacker if this is allowed. Use the “high/low principle”. After every two to three straight punches, immediately go downstairs with a groin kick or the aforementioned round kick to the leg.
When working on defense be mobile. Don’t stand and exchange. Move your feet. Keep your lead leg outside of of your opponents lead leg. Move your head. Don’t wait. Attack your opponents limbs. Hammer fists to his forearms, elbow and biceps.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
The superman punch doesn’t seem like a good idea for someone who lacks the distance, timing and judgement to land conventional punches.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
It could be that you are paired up with someone who has a lot more experience. If you are getting hammered every time, you should ask to pair up with someone more on your level.
While sparring with someone better than you can help, it can also hurt if they are so superior that all you do is cover up and wait for someone to yell “break”.
If that’s the case, it could be your schools fault as well.
.02
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
quote Ryan:Ok, giving fight advice on the internet is likely not the greatest of ideas, but let’s just look at one concept that may help. Practice “incidental defenses”. In other words, be a hard target, not by actively defending, but through head movement, footwork, and high covers. These tactics will let you focus more on your offense (since no one wins by defense.) Don’t wait for openings, create them.Go back and watch “Rocky III,” which I think is the one where Apollo Creed trains him to fight Clubber Lang and really drills him on the footwork.
Makes Rock learn how to “dance”… ROFL!!!
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
quote CLFMak:The superman punch doesn’t seem like a good idea for someone who lacks the distance, timing and judgement to land conventional punches.That’s true but its a great confidence booster to land it and shock the guy. That and spinning backfists are the ones that no one ever sees coming. It’s just having fun and its not that hard to learn in the context of light sparring.
BTW if someone keeps owning you tell them to lighten up a bit. If you’re a novice people shouln’t be going full out. Thats a sure fire way to have people give up.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
quote Nemo_Dat:That’s true but its a great confidence booster to land it and shock the guy. That and spinning backfists are the ones that no one ever sees coming. It’s just having fun and its not that hard to learn in the context of light sparring.BTW if someone keeps owning you tell them to lighten up a bit. If you’re a novice people shouln’t be going full out. Thats a sure fire way to have people give up.
You know…..I think that’s the best advice for the guy who keeps getting “owned” in fight class. Tell your partners to go easy until you are more comfortable with your movement, avoidance, and counter-attacking skills.
Nemo_Dat is right on. I mean…after all…we want “Fiend” to keep coming back and improving himself.
As for learning how to “dance;’ C’mon, Miriam. I thought having Mick teach Rocky how to chase down a chicken in Rocky II was equally good training! lol
Mario
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
It’s been said in this post but it needs repeating……good footwork, spacing and b/w.
As a novice at the fight game, it will serve you well if you can stay balanced on your feet and stay outside the lead leg of your opponent. This is not to say go runnin’ around the ring like a chicken with your head cut off. But more in the way of making yourself a hard target to hit. (smacks of the Ali rope a dope) But my meaning here is if you are straight lining on your way in, you are giving your sparring partner little to discover on how to get his gloves on you. Bob/Weave, footwork, distance and quickness on ones feet will serve you well. Also get your combo’s down cold. This is the reason many or most fighters, boxing or mma, shadow box constantly. they are constantly trying to sharpen up their combos. Try it sometime throughout your week. Mix in some good footwork drills (find plenty online). When you go back to the gym, have a mindset of stick and move. I hope this helps. Everyone had to start somewhere, so don’t get down on yourself, just keep swingin’
Goodluck!!! JLRe: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
Bring a bag a sand with you, at the start of the fight throw a handful of sand in their eyes.
Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
I agree with carpe sounds to me like you are trying to
think about what to do instead of just flowing which should
come with time and practice.Fighting is as much mental
as it is physical.Re: Getting totally owned in fight class… Help!
OK – I wrote so much, I wanted to put this at the top. Someone very early on recommended jumping rope a lot to get me better conditioned for footwork. I need to start that again.
Oh yes. I think within the first three classes, I might have been one of the guys “owning” you. I remember feeling so good. I barely got hit. I was able to move around and felt really comfortable. That all changed, but those were the good ole days.
My training partner and I started together. He was great at KM; aggressive, technically proficient. But he was very frustrated in intro to fight. I am taller. I am longer. I was much more aggressive while sparring. We switched partners often. I saw the same things in others. They were wide eyed. They really didn’t want me to hit them. They would retreat and think about defending my attacks. I learned that if I kept throwing jabs, even if they had next to nothing on them, I could keep my opponent worrying about getting hit and they would forget to throw at me.
Man was I proud of myself. But it also made me look at myself and how it went for me. I also switched to a partner that looked visibly scared of fighting. (Oooh! I need to preface this with pointing out how when you spar and train with someone regularly, you learn them. even at 50%, you go a little harder because you know each others limits. Conversely, you go a little lighter when you know someone and don’t want to push them too far in their limits) Well, this guy showed me with his first few punches and combinations that he wanted to play 50% meaning 50%, and he wanted to make the motions and practice extending punches and defending the punches, but he had no intention of really hitting me or being hit buy me. I felt it was akin to the difference between sparring with someone and doing tai chi at the park. We went through the motions, but it was just posturing with incredibly slow movements. It wasn’t much for fighting, but it was great for vision. It was good for stringing together combos (in super dynamic slo-mo). It was good for me. It was good that he let it know that he wanted to slow down. Now just seeing his physical stature, I would not have come at him like a bull out of the gates. But it was still better to set the ground rules. Because it also let me know that while I didn’t think it was appropriate to hit him too hard, it also let me know that he didn’t plan on me being his punching bag either.
I realized that I was going a little too aggressively against people in general for us both to get out of the class what we needed. I have slowed it down a lot since then when sparring all the time. I make sure I stop and give openings so it is a trade, not just someone defending me. But I have also learned that if going into a “fight” smother them and don’t give them the luxury of feeling like they can hit me too. I also start every spar with someone by telling them: Tell me to slow down when I start going to hard. I will try to slow it down, but you’ll scare me when you start hitting me and I will speed up. I feel like it sets the tone right off the bat that you are more than welcome (and it is my error, not your weakness) to slow me down. And it also keeps it in my head right before we start sparring. I haven’t had anyone ask me to slow down. I have said it to myself out loud while sparring.
Also, I am not great at sparring at all. I feel like I wrote this as if I am a killer at sparring. My hat gets handed to me all the time. I am not nearly as good as I even think this portrayed me. And lately, it has been getting handed to me more. I feel like I am good enough that it invites people to spar pretty well against me. And they do. I have only been down on myself because I feel like I have had so many flaws exposed lately. I do fairly well against people at my level. But people who know what they are doing really toy with me. I have been getting particularly great advice from instructors lately. I can see how the subtle (which are paramount) pointers really help. It is like in intro to fight, we were learning get in, get your shots, and get out. I will too often stand there, right in someone’s live side, ready to trade, planning on getting the better of it (and then still not). I was moving in and out. I was coached to move around a lot more side to side. Then there was just letting my head sit there as I defend and counter. I was given the advice of keeping my head moving. I can see it. I need to put it into play more.
I had this one guy stand right in front of me, throw his leg out and back heal me in the nose (yes, through my head gear). I could not believe how he even did it, let alone how I could just stand there and not move away. I was glad my nose wasn’t broken (and I wasn’t so sure it wasn’t at first).Then I let the same fool kick me in the back of the head not more than ten minutes later. I am not even sure which direction that kick started.
Good Luck,
Dave
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