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Happy New Year Guys!
It’s been a while since I have been around. It’s good to be back. As some of you know I started a blog some time ago and I have some aritcles that I have written and I’d love your feedback. Please be as critical as you wish. I welcome the conversation. Thanks a lot guys. Be safe and train hard.
http://www.kravtalk.blogspot.com/2011/11/grounded-why-using-jiu-jitsu-in-street.html
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
Good article. Thanks for posting it. I see BJJ practitioners in our training center that I believe would try to take a street fight to the ground . I think their familiarity with the system makes them forget their surroundings. Also, these people seem to think that their adversary will be unable to prevent their takedown attempt.
In the ring, many options that the Kravist has available like elbows or hammers to the base of the skull are unavailable. I think that grapplers forget this in street situations.
You must have ground skills if a fight goes to the ground. The most important one IMO, is getting up faster than your opponent.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
Great article!
I’m currently taking the ground fighting classes at my training center and it’s focused in BJJ. However, there are some differences between the Krav Maga ground fighting techniques and the ground fighting techniques taught in the ground fighting classes. The ground fight classes is more oriented towards a “ring” setting which kind of offsets my Krav Maga mentality of getting someone in guard (or mounting), striking hard, eye gouging, hammer fists, etc. etc. I’m taking these classes to supplement the techniques in the self defense classes as I feel the ground techniques being taught in the self defense classes are not enough.
If the guy that’s picking a fight with you is well versed in wrestling or BJJ/JJ techniques, the Krav Maga practitioner won’t stand much of a chance when he tries to take you to the ground if the KM practitioner doesn’t know what to look for and how to defend it/escape any chokes and submissions.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
I just finished reading all the articles on your web site.Thank you for making them available to us.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
Good post psyops. There’s a reason Krav doesn’t teach a ton of ground – basically we learn how to disengage and get the hell up. It’s a bad place to be.
BJJ is fun and I have a blast rolling, but doubt I would be interested in taking any fight to the ground. Multiple attackers, ground hazards, cement … that is all stuff no one talks about in BJJ.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
Hallo! Very good Article. The best training that I belive in is FAST defense training with the New Predator Armor and scenario training full contact. Thanks.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
wish i lived in vegas so i could train at your place. your mind set and mine are very similar.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
I agree with the majority of the article. However, I do NOT agree that being on the ground is a deathwish or that the majority of fights do not end up on the ground. I’ve been in security and law enforcement for over 20 years. I have worked corrections for the last 3. Every fight I’ve seen and been involved in has gone to the ground. The only exceptions are the ones that we broke up before they got there. Once they went to the ground, the guy on top had the clear advantage (unless it was one of us on the bottom). Obviously due to most people not training on the ground. Training from a position of disadvantage is absolutely necessary. To say being in any position is a deathwish is only setting you and your students up for failure. All aspects of the fight must be explored. We need to train what we hate to train. Training on the ground with the intention of getting back up may not work either. You could be seriously outweighed or stunned from a sneak attack. It is possible to have to spend SOME time on the ground.
However, I absolutely agree with the fact that WANTING to be on the ground in a real fight is a mistake especially due to all the environmental hazards mentioned and multiple attackers.
This is just my opinion.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
I don’t think Donavin meant to imply that we shouldn’t learn how to fight on the ground. Rather, he meant to say we should do it the right way and BJJ ain’t it. Looking through his web site, I noticed he teaches 3 ground classes a week in addition to the regular krav classes.
I just watched Nir Maman’s excellent DVDs again. In the intro to the ground DVD, he says:
“This is not a grappling system. We’re not going to learn submission holds or joint locks. What we’re going to learn is how to quickly escape grappling holds on the ground and how to quickly control, incapacitate or terminate our attacker while he has us on the ground.”
I think that’s what Donavin (Nir’s friend and student) is getting at in his blog. Nir’s stuff, both ground and standup, is simple, brutal and pure krav in spirit but it’s not all in KMW curriculum, at least at the levels below black belt.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
@RESQR1 You missed the point of my article. With all due respect to your experience I have been in many fights. Too many and very rarely did I end up on the ground. Ground survival is not Jiu Jitsu. My students do train on the ground. The difference is that we don’t teach Jiu Jitsu. It is , in my opinion an ineffective street system. Great for the ring not for the street.Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
If the point of the article is that BJJ isn’t the end all be all of DT/MA/MMA/RBSD/etc, I agree. If the point of the article is that BJJ is useless or worthless, I respectfully disagree. Either way, thanks for sharing and stimulating thought/discussion.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
Worthless is too strong. Useless is too strong as well. I am not enamored with BJJ. I think it is a nice addition to your overall skill set. But again most BJJ schools teach sport BJJ not self defense. So its phony. I am very confident that if I start inside the guard of a BJJ practioner and he is doing BJJ and I am using the tactics I describe in the article and on the video, he won’t like that very much. It is so simple.
Re: Ground Survival Article!!!
Personally, I would reserve “phony” for a system or school (etc) that had little or nothing worthwhile to add to one’s overall skill set or taught things egregiously bad (e.g. teaching that the bugs bunny finger in the barrel is an effective/useful technique). IMO, BJJ gives you much more than “little” or “nothing”.
As far as comparing, I don’t think you’re comparing evenly. “dirty” BJJ and “sport” BJJ are two completely different animals – all else being equal, I’d put my money on the “dirty” BJJ practitioner. Now that being said, how about comparing two guys who have the same level of “dirty” but one is fluent in ground/BJJ (and being dirty in ground/BJJ) while the other doesn’t have any ground/BJJ? All else being equal, I’d put my money on the “more rounded” dirty guy…
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