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Long time-No post…….
I have a question about weapons training and what is taught in the KM curriculum. In class we do a lot of weapons take-away, but there is sparse information on how to effectively use these weapons that we now have after the disarm.
In all of the traditional martial arts I have studied there was always some component of training with various weapons.
Thinking of sticks, firearms, knives, etc…..
For the instructors out there, what do you do? Do you refer your students off to other courses/instructors? Or do you teach some of these things yourself?
Re: Weapons Training
I never done any weapon defense but I imagine it will be more complex than hand to hand but I dont know.
At my school they put the weapon defense all in level 4-5. Seems that level 4-5 is 80 percent weapon defense or so.
Seems very few students ever get past level 3 through.
I just started level 2-3 and this is enough information for me.Re: Weapons Training
quote donjon:i also never use any weapon for defenseNeither do I……except maybe for the razor knife in my front pocket, the brass knuckles in my hip pocket and the .38 in my waistband. :dunno:
Re: Weapons Training
Laws are obviously a very important thing to keep in mind when being retaliatory with a weapon that you have taken from an attacker. For one, if you used their “taken away” weapon on them, they would be “unarmed” and you could be charged with assault or worse.
Laws aside – there are other things to keep in mind. If the defense is against a knife stab or slash, the attacker will most likely drop the blunt object / knife when you counter attack to their face as is in our curriculum. Also, the “takeaway” portion of all weapon defenses is last for a reason – because if the redirection, control, and attack were done correctly, the takeaway most likely won’t be necessary.
If a handgun is taken away, it can be used as a “cold weapon”, or in simpler terms a “500 dollar hammer”. Use the barrel as an extension of a normal straight punch. (not the butt/frame because it could be polymer or jam the magazine, etc.)
Same with a long gun defense – don’t shoot an unarmed person, just whack ’em with the barrel if your attacks weren’t quite enough to incapacitate the attacker. (worst case scenario)
Lastly, with a longer blunt object or stick defense, there is an effective and quick way to utilize the stick after taking it away. By gripping the stick at the top and bottom, (like a baseball bat, but with the upper hand sliding to the top of the bat while the bottom hand stays at the bottom) it can be used for attack and defense. The middle, ungripped portion can be used for outside defense (360) and the butt of the stick can be used to make quick (almost impossible to defend) jabs to the attacker’s face. Those attacks also look a little less aggressive to Joe Shmo who may happen to see you reciprocating an attacker’s aggression thinking you’re the criminal.
Hope that helped : )
– Forrest
Re: Weapons Training
If you hope to fire the gun again, I wouldn’t punch with the barrel unless you’re intimately familiar with firearms and how various models function. You could punch someone with the barrel of a 1911 while the safety is on because, unless it has a safety cut, the slide cannot move to the rear while the safety is on. Do it with a Beretta 92FS and you’ll push the slide/barrel out of battery, possibly enough to extract the round from the chamber, but not enough to eject it, causing a stovepipe. Hitting someone with the but of the gun generally will not damage the magazine and polymer hurts too. More than likely if you hit someone with the pistol grip you’ll dislodge some of the rounds on the magazine and the way they’re seated will not be how the magazine was designed to seat them.
There is always an exception to every rule. Think about force generation capability and the disparity of force: is a 265ib man attacks a 120ib woman, more than likely she would be justified in using deadly force. If the roles were reversed, he would probably be charged with a crime due to the effect that gender bias has on situations such as this. However, if a person has a serious medical condition, say a history of concussions/traumatic brain injury where any impact to the head could potentially kill or maim, the aggressor would not necessarily know this but the victim still might be justified in using deadly force to protect his/her life.
Depending on the state, you may have a law/rule where you must make every attempt to de-escalate or escape possible before using deadly force, and in other states you may hold your ground and protect your property.Re: Weapons Training
As much as I’d like to use a handgun as a blunt, striking object, I feel that creating space after getting the gun is best. If you’re creating distance and trying to remove yourself from the situation and the assailant is still coming towards you, even when you’re telling him to stop, would that not be a justifiable reason to shoot him/them right there on the spot?
Re: Weapons Training
quote KMyoshi:As much as I’d like to use a handgun as a blunt, striking object, I feel that creating space after getting the gun is best. If you’re creating distance and trying to remove yourself from the situation and the assailant is still coming towards you, even when you’re telling him to stop, would that not be a justifiable reason to shoot him/them right there on the spot?Do you believe that you or someone else is in imminent threat of serious bodily injury or death at that point?
Re: Weapons Training
quote Don:Do you believe that you or someone else is in imminent threat of serious bodily injury or death at that point?Given the scenario described, I’d say “yes.” But, I’m not a lawyer and this doesn’t constitute legal advice :):. What I’d be worried about at that point though is why is this guy unafraid of his own gun, is it loaded? Does it work?
Re: Weapons Training
quote stuartf:Given the scenario described, I’d say “yes.” But, I’m not a lawyer and this doesn’t constitute legal advice :):. What I’d be worried about at that point though is why is this guy unafraid of his own gun, is it loaded? Does it work?I was going to say the same thing. Wouldn’t be the first time someone used a water-gun or bb-gun in a robbery attempt.
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