Level 2 in L.A and hating it.

[kravmagastudent]

Re:

quote \”Sean_AKrav\:

I have been taking Krav since July 10. I will be VERY happy to take level 2 classes if I passed. I took the classes offered at bowie for a while and then moved down to VA during the break between bowie classes.

I am also looking forward to fight night.

It didn’t seem too quick to me really.

WoW.. Sean.. that’s great to hear… Jason and I took 8 months to test for Level 2… even though we were going 5 days per week… and 2 – 3 classes per night… and you know how hard we trained… guess some places are better equiped to test than others… 😯

[jasonm]

Re:

quote \”Giantkiller\:

Maybe it’s because the MD school is bigger and has more tests? It shouldn’t take too long to reach LV2. At the NTC it’s 3-4 months I think, if you come regularly (twice a week or more). What school do you go to now, Jason? Maybe you should give MD a try.

_________________
Giantkiller

I wish I could goto one of the MD schools but they are a little far. I think about an hour or so drive. 🙁

My whole thing is why should people that are ready to test be held back from testing? I was told it wasn’t fair if we tested because others weren’t ready. Well how fair is that to the ones that area ready.

And I test into level 2 after 8 months. And that was training more than 2x per week. I was training about 4-5x per week at 2-3 hours per class.

[jl]

Tank,
I hope John Whitman can fix this for you. ALL instructors should be up to speed on the curriculum and how to bring new students at that level along so they are not missing any techniques applications or anything else for that matter.

We have been waiting for several months to test for L2. Some of these people have been in Krav for 4 YEARS!!!! Then we find out that our instructor failed L3 Instructor Course so here we sit, at the ready, but with NO new curriculum to learn. When we asked why he thinks he failed, he said that the NTC has not told him why just that he will have to take another week off work and go to LA and spend his time trying to pass something he has no idea of why he failed in the first place.So as we see others in the KM community move up level after level, it gets really frustrating when you know you can’t move up until there is an instructor that can teach it. I mean come on, there should be more uniformity on the time spent on these Levels. The disparity between schools is quite vast and also very bothersome to the growth of KM in this area.

[wyatt9696]

I don’t get all the emphasis put on \”testing\”. For me, it’s more of a stay in shape, learn self-defense scenario. Granted, it’s nice to test and attain each level, but it’s the long term effects(too me anyway) that are more important. I personally just try to continue to learn the techniques at each level. If I test once, twice, three times a year, i could care less. I’m 48 years old, and for me, it’s not a goal oriented thing. It’s a keep fit and be able to defend myself kind of thing. I by no means am bashing anyone who wants to move up the ranks quickly. I’m just personally hoping to stay a great shape, and be able to defend myself, if need be. Just my 2 cents. Hope I didn’t offend anyone

[sean-akrav]

Wow that is a very long time. However if I don’t deserve to be at level 2 (I know you guys aren’t saying that) or if I didn’t have the form and technique down I have faith that my instructors will let me know. I thought I had a pretty decent grasp of what level 1 had to offer.

Really for me moving up is not really about staying in shape as it is about learning new subject matter. To be honest I was getting tired of learning the same level 1 stuff and I want another challenge. I want to be effective at self defense. I am very excited to learn level 2 material, but at the same time I know its good to have a good base to learn from.

Also if staying in shape is what Krav is for you trust me when I say that the level 1 test was probably one of the hardest physical tests I have had this far in Krav. I’m pretty sure my shirt from Saturday is still sitting in my hamper wet with sweat haha.

I don’t really know why there is such a disparity between times it takes to test for different levels. I don’t think our instructors would have let me test if they didn’t think I was ready though.

[jl]

wyatt
No offense taken. I think the thing is less about what level you are, and more about moving to a higher level of training. Without instructors at those higher levels, it is very hard to move to a higher plain in this or any other Self Defense. To study the upper- levels you must have the curriculum to do it. And the proper training of those techniques is paramount to all of us.
Please understand, I’m assigning no blame here. I am simply stating that in certain parts of the country, the process of learning and instruction seem to be on a different page than in others. I would simply submit that a tighter set of controls, checks and balances be implemented nationally.
I just think it’s ridiculous that a student puts in 4 yrs and isn’t passed level 2 curriculum.

[jl]

By the way….the 4 yr. student is not me. I don’t know that I would have stayed at this school if I were they. However, the instructor here is very good and tries real hard at moving things along. But when he failed the L3 Instructor course, it put the whole L2 class months behind. For you see, we have to wait until he passes his test in L3 before we can move up to that level. I don’t know this to be true, but, our instructor thinks he didn’t pass because of a seminar on a different style of SD he was attending, got back to the powers to be at NTC.
I don’t know that this is true and would be saddened if it were.

[wyatt9696]

I certainly understand that it would be frustrating as a student, that can’t get to a higher rank due to lack of a certified instructor. Unfortunately, this is the way it is. If you’re in a more \”metro\” area, obviously there’s probably more certified instructors, at different levels, than in a more rural area. IMO, Krav has just started taking off in this country over the last 4-5 years. It’s not as mainstream as the top martial art systems, etc… There are bound to be many growing pains. This is where living in the city atmosphere would have an advantage to living in a smalltown. Hopefully the instructors in the smaller areas will keep up on their phase training in order for their students and their respective schools to grow. A lot of the schools offer Krav as a sideline to the main martial art being offered. My guess, and school owners can correct me if I’m wrong, is that the level of certification would go with the student base. What I mean is that if a school has say 15-20 Krav students, and the other Martial Art offered at the same location has say 100 students. There would be more emphasis put on that group, versus the Krav group. I’m not saying that Krav should take a back seat, but reality is that, if your bread and butter is the other self-defense system, it’s hard to commit more time and money towards the secondary system, in this case Krav, unless it’s making you money. Lots of smaller schools also have less intructors as well, so for a sole instructor to take a week to go away for training has to be well planned out in advance, in order not to cripple his/her school and their livelyhood. I know I was trying to make a point here, hopefully I did. Good luck with your training, Sorry for rambling.

[dkolb]

\”I don’t know this to be true, but, our instructor thinks he didn’t pass because of a seminar on a different style of SD he was attending, got back to the powers to be at NTC.
I don’t know that this is true and would be saddened if it were.\” óJL

i’m sure john will have something to say about this… but that’s a bunch of crap. many of our instructors have diverse MA backgrounds with experience in many different styles. your instructor didn’t pass because he was somehow lacking in the L3 material. period. the instructors who run the phase training are professionals and dont give a damn about who does what style. now if he were trying to incorporate the outside style into krav techniques, then there is an issue. would you rather the NTC pass a sub-par practiotioner to go back and teach sub-par techniques to you and your classmates?

\”When we asked why he thinks he failed, he said that the NTC has not told him why just that he will have to take another week off work and go to LA and spend his time trying to pass something he has no idea of why he failed in the first place\” óJL

either your instructor is in complete denial or did not really ask why he failed. there is no way a L3 licencee would not be informed of his shortcomings and be asked to work on them for next time. it makes no sense. i’m sorry you have to wait to advance to the next level but for your instructor to blame the NTC for that is utterly ridiculous.

[markx3]

You tell em Dave!

[jl]

dkolb,
Again, I\”ll say that I don’t know of any TRUTH to any of what we were told as far as the why he didn’t pass. I personally don’t care why he didn’t pass. It puts me and the students that have been in this thing a long time, (and are trying to build a strong base of KM practitioners) at a huge disadvantage from a curriculum standpoint. We can’t move on until the instructor does, the L1 people are coming into L2 and here we sit. I believe that the NTC has demonstrated their desire to put a first class product out to the public. And in many ways I think they have. I guess some of us are just a little disenchanted with the fact we are ready to learn and have noone to bring us to the next level. There is a core of us in this situation. We were here for the start of KM in this area, and aren’t leaving the KM community because of this. We are just frustrated. I do however believe most of the points you made. Again, please understand I’m speaking out of concern, I am not passing blame onto anyone!

[anonymous]

Hey, interesting discussion!

First of all, for those who aren’t being tested into LV2, because there aren’t enough people to take the test, maybe they should be allowed to take LV2 classes anyway and then take the test whenever it will take place. If you are ready to move up, you should be able to move up. As far as I know, testing has never been required to move up. If you are coming five times a week, taking up to three classes each time, you should be able to get into LV2 relatively quickly, maybe two, three months at most. If they don’t offer tests, they should advance you without you having to take one (or you could take it later).

For JL’s situation, that really sucks. Can’t tell if politics played a role here or not. One thing about the instructor’s course is also that it is expensive, even more so if you have to fly all the way to LA, room and board, plus the training etc. Some people may feel that they make enough money with the LV1 and LV2 students, so why bother offering LV3.

One of the problems with the smaller schools may be that they care about teaching their primary martial art first and KM is just something they use to get people into the school. They may not have the same passion for KM as someone, who has been doing it practically his whole life and whose primary martial art it is. So there may be less interest in it overall, they may even look at it as more of a quick fix/beginner’s workout and hope that the student will ultimately sign up for the \”real thing\” Taekwondo, Karate, whatever it may be. I’m personally more in favor of opening \”pure\” KM schools than giving out licenses to these Taekwondo places, but I guess there are pros and cons to anything.

_________________
Giantkiller

[jl]

GK,
Excellent points. The point you made about having just KM schools is where my opinion is. I think that for the last few years the dojo we are at treats the Krav people like unwanted,uninvited guests. 🙄 I know the bulk of their income comes from the karate side. But what really grabs my a$$ is when a BB comes up to us and says that the things we learn in KM are built for the street and how can they get into the class to learn some reality based SD.
So I don’t know, is the real money in TMA or is that a short sided view of what could be. I personally think that a real KM center would do fantastic once the word got out. Let the little Ninja’s go to Karate class, I think it is a great thing for young people to start. As they grow older KM class! 😉

[anonymous]

I think one of the reasons that they didn’t open more \”pure\” KM schools initiallly, was that they simply didn’t have enough long-time experienced instructors, who would be willing to move to another state and open a school there. Through an instructor’s program and giving out licenses, they can get KM to more people faster. That would be the advantage, on the other hand, it may lead to problems such as some schools, who may not care much about KM and are not teaching it correctly. And since there are so many of them, it’s not easy to control them.

Of course, one would have to weigh all of these pros and cons and come up with a system that is as high in quantity as it is in quality, which isn’t always easy.

_________________
Giantkiller

[kmcat]

Here in Kansas City the school my son & I go to is a KM only school.

My son & I do the Krav Maga self defense classes and I have been doing the fitness classes as well.

We have been very pleased with the learning experience here. Recently my son & I passed the level 1 test and have moved up to the level 2 classes. They have been pretty interesting and very good.

Today in the fitness class we did a whole lot of punching and arm workouts. We did a exercise with weights that turned my arms to noodles by the end of the class — tying in quite nicely to the punching we learn in self defense.

I don’t think I would care to atend a school that had KM as a sidebar thing.

By the way, some of the more experienced/longer-term students and instructors participate in Mixed Martial Arts amature fights. They are starting to have problems getting other fighters to go up against them (one of the fellows did a fight late this summer and it lasted 12 seconds with him knocking out his opponent). KM Rocks!

[Author]

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