@gadfly
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Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
quote jsumm54421:I really enjoy your comments. Hey, the military thing is your big issue not mine.Happy New Year jsumm. If you’re as tenacious in a fight as you are in defending your position here then I wouldn’t like to get in the ring with you. Don’t get me wrong, I disagree wholly with you and I think you’re going to end up pretty embarrassed, but kudos for being the only one of Moni’s crew to publicly stand up and defend the faith/cult.
To be frank mate I’ll respect you all the more when you remove this from your website’s home page:
(Moni)is a master in jui-jitsu and judo, the trainer of many world class MMA fighters and the one asked to develop the updated hand to hand combat system for the Israeli Elite Military Forces!
There’s other references in the “CKM Founder” tab to the CKM creation myth that you could think about dropping to show that you’re serious when you say you don’t care about the military stuff. Might also be handy if/when the lawyers get involved
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
quote jsumm54421:I don’t think about this because it has nothing to do with why I train and my students train.Hi jsumm,
The name and reputation of Krav Maga is a major factor behind your students’ decision to train with you. The belief that “it must be good because it’s done in the IDF” recruits and retains – it might not be right but it’s there man and once Moni is fully exposed your business and reputation will suffer.You’re right about the need to respect and understand other styles including Judo, Aizik’s speciality and a much underestimated martial art.
If Aizik had just called his system Combat Judo and not told a pack of lies about his background and that of his system, I could understand your position. I notice that you don’t deny any of this. To be honest mate your priority now should not be the defence of this guy who has screwed you: you need to manage your withdrawal from CKM in a way that maintains your own dignity and reputation.I’m not saying this in a smart-ass way, I genuinely feel for your position as I’ve been there myself. Happy to help if I can, feel free to contact me.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
quote blanker:i have trained with the ikmf in st albans, acton, alperton and tottenham cout road the ckm in uxbridge a few times and urban krav maga in harrow as you can see i travel around nw london alot so i have to train where i can.Cheers,
the guy in Uxbridge has left CKM for another system. He wasn’t so taken with CKM as you were, but I suspect that whenever you trained with him he was probably teaching stuff outside the system anyway. A lot of those guys on the UK list of CKM instructors have either left the system or are in the process of leaving. Of the 41 names on the list there are 15 I know of who have no more to do with CKM or are in the process of moving out. They still have one guy on there who has actually written to Moni demanding his money back after the recent revelations – he hasn’t had a reply yet but I’m sure Moni will do the decent thing.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
quote blanker:its a shame that he had to talk such bull****! as commando krav maga is a very very good system and moni seems to be a very good martial artist.he has managed to discretit a very good martial art and one that (in the u.k anyway) seems to have alot more classes then krav maga.
Hi blanker,
who have you trained with in the UK to form that view of CKM? Not asking in any rhetorical way, genuinely interested.
also, there are quite a few more Krav Maga teachers than CKM in the UK, I’m not sure where you’ve looked.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
quote blokrocbet:Why the anger with CKM? is it because he used krav maga in the title? Let me be clear im not defending moni CKM is most def not krav maga. Im just trying to get a grasp on the issue so i dont offend anyone.The Case against CKM:
He lied about his military career – he was a Fitness instructor rather than a Special Forces fighter.
He made up outlandish stories about his unit being wiped out in a surprise attack and being asked to work with Imi Lichtenfeld to put together a new hand-to-hand system for the Israeli Defence Forces.
He spuriously claimed that his system was that used by the Israeli Special Forces.
He lied about having a contract to return to Israel each month to teach hand-to-hand combat to various Special Units.
He arrogated credibility for his system through these fabrications and, on the basis of that unwarranted credibility, took a lot of money from people.
The Case for CKM:
Yet to be heard as neither he nor his people have put together a cogent defence and publicised it.
Does that explain the anger? He has a right to criticise other styles of Krav Maga and compete against them. It’s the alleged mesh of fabrication that has caused the upset.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
Who do you believe in more guys? Moni or Santa Claus? Moni would in in fact make a great Santa. “Merry Xmas kids, come and buy some toys. And let me tell you about the time me and Rudolf got together with Charles Dickens to write A Christmas Carol and re-invent the celebration of Christmas”
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
Hey JL and Psyops,
get off your fences guys and say what you really think. If I were Obama I’d appoint you two as the Ambassadors to China and Iran respectively – we’re going to have to fight them sometime so let’s kick it all off now while we still have a chance…
Seriously, your points are unanswerable – maybe we should have stopped being civil about this guy a little earlier and he’d have ripped off fewer people.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
jsumm,
I’ve seen your website man and you seem a real decent guy but your post comes over as a little patronising. I only have opinions on styles in which I’ve trained in or in which I’ve worked with some experienced practitioners. I normally keep these opinions to myself but I occasionally make an exception with CKM because I’m anxious that decent folk like yourself don’t hand over any more dough to Aizik and stop publicising his falsehoods.
I don’t agree about all techniques being good mate, there is room for variation based on what suits your body and psyche best, but there are certain things that you need to do re, say, blocking kicks/punches and adopting a defensive fence that if done wrongly will make it tough for you to avoid getting hurt. Also, any techniques based on defending wholly unrealistic attacks such as non-recoiled punches just aren’t worth doing.
Differences in opinion re techniques are fair enough and personally I’m always open to ideas – that which I teach now is different from how it was 5 or 10 years ago; CKM goes beyond the pale due to the very dubious claims of the founder.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
quote coatesy:Can you tell me his name the ckm director who resigned so i can email him cheers
clubber langI’ll check if the guy is ok with that – shouldn’t be a problem
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
you’ve got a point about KM and CKM being complementary as Aizik does bring a judo/jiu jutsu grappling element to the party. Some of his stuff is good but in my humble opinion some of the punch and knife defences were fantasy and would get you twatted/killed.
The law is much more sporting over here than you believe re self defence: remember the Indian shopkeeper who was threatend by some lowlife with a knife? in the ensuing struggle he took the knife and killed the guy with it. I don’t think he was even prosecuted. As long as you can demonstrate that you had showed reasonable force and had an honest belief that your life was in danger, you should be OK. This also applies to the police, who don’t have to be that politically correct if somebody is swinging a knife at them.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
blokrocbet,
see this
http://www.asa.org.uk/asa/adjudications/Public/TF_ADJ_45208.htmand read the rest of this thread
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
Ivor,
the substantial proof lies in Moni’s inability to produce any evidence to substantiate his claims. In the UK this month his advert in Martial Arts Illustrated for his DVDs now contains no reference to his being a super army soldier or counter terror expert. This has been a key selling point for the guy – don’t you think if he had the evidence he would produce it?
Also, if he had the evidence he should produce it just to provide some back up and support for his Instructors who are now having to deal with the growing scepticism about CKM. If the evidence is there and he gave a toss about his instructors, he should produce it. That he doesn’t give a toss about his instructors is also evinced by that fact that his regular 1-page advert for his DVDs in Martial Arts Illustrated never mentions how you can find a CKM instructor in the UK, it’s all about him selling his stuff.
Don’t mention the the secrecy excuse, we know that’s bollocks.
Did you see that the UK Director for CKM has resigned? This is the second he’s lost within the year.
I se that Black Belt in America has a 6 page feature on Aizik containing the usual stuff. Can I suggest that somebody over there contact that magazine to let them know that they run a mighty reputational risk by continuing to publicise this dubious organisation.
Worse, he’s going to be teaching Law Enforcement in the USA. The schedule is:
April 2009: West Palm Beach, Florida and then Los Angeles
June 2009: London, England; Indianapolis; Miami
August 2009, Long Island.
You can see the exact dates here:
http://www.commandokravmaga.com/html/application_form.html#dates
American cops have enough to deal with (I’ve seen The Shield) without being trained by CKM so maybe some of you guys over there could make enquiries and ensure that the relevant authorities are aware of the whole picture. Re the London date, leave that to us.
Remember, bad things happen when the good guys sit around playing with their Biggons.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
check out the current wikipedia entry for Aizik:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moni_Aizik
at the time of posting this refers to him being a physical fitness trainer and to his recent problems with the UK Advertising Standards Authority. There have been a few people removing references to the ASA and then others have returned them, but nobody has attempted to remove that about his being a physical fitness trainer. Maybe this is the new orthodoxy.
Somebody in the US really should get onto the Federal Trade Commission about his advertising and his website. Come on guys, you’re supposed to be the get-up-and-go nation, not us old farts in the UK who spend most of our time cursing about “who won the war anyway?” This could take me into a discussion of my own record in the Scottish Special Forces but I have to keep it quiet. Suffice to say I was invalided out for having terminal bad teeth and was one of only 5 members of my regiment not to end up with a job in the fast food industry.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
quote coatesy:would anyone have a problem with ckm if it was called something different.I’m not so concerned with the name, it’s more the fabricated history and credentials that are of concern. If he called it say, Israeli Combat Judo, but still kept up with the “developed and taught in the Israeli Special Forces” stuff then the integrity/honesty issue would remain.
Like I say mate, maybe give it a try and draw your own conclusions but don’t believe any of the marketing hype re CKM’s place in the Israeli Defence Forces: that’s just bollocks.
Re: Commando Krav Maga / CKM / Moni Aizik
Coatesy,
I saw your post on the CKM forum. Nobody is being abusive or unhelpful here, we’re being helpful by giving you the facts. See here for the Advertising Standards Authority ruling:
http://www.asa.org.uk/asa/adjudications/Public/TF_ADJ_45208.htmAs a former military guy I’m sure that you realise that his defence that he’s not able to reveal his regiment, rank, qualifications achieved etc. is tosh. Nobody is asking him to reveal details of any special operations that he undertook – they would have been 35 years ago anyway. Wholly up to you mate but the evidence currently suggest that if you give this guy your money based on the belief that you’re buying into his knowledge gained through fighting/teaching in the Israeli Defence Forces (IDF), then like a lot of other people you will have been conned.
Difficult to comment on CKM now as I’m sure that he’s changed things a lot since I last trained with them. The fact that the system has changed so much over the last 2 years should tell you something – don’t believe that cobblers re “evolution” – a system developed over 30 years in the IDF wouldn’t have changed so much in such a short space of time.
You’re best advised to try a CKM class a couple of times before you commit any dough. Always question the reality of the attacks defended if you try this or any other class. I’m happy to help directly mate feel free to drop me a private message if you’re interested.
